[REL] Fall of the Rising Sun Ultimate, full release

[WH4K]

I seem to have stumbled upon another serious bug.

Returned to Midway in late November 1944. Was awarded an upgrade to the Tench class boat.

Accepted and set up loadout, crew etc for next patrol.

Cannot start next patrol. Whether I choose to start outside or inside of harbor, game crashes to desktop during loading.

Rebooted machine & restarted game a couple times, no change. Likewise, fullscreen vs. windowed mode.

If I go back to a save before returning to Midway & refuse the upgrade, I am able to start next patrol in the old Balao. But what fun is that?

As before, using only FOTRS:UE 1.24 + 1.26 patch.

[mikesn9]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

I am in the middle of testing that now mikesn9, and one thing that I have now "proven" is that at night, if you have an improperly configured game set-up, the moon and its reflection do not match... When I first did a quick mission for this test, I used the Tambor, but neglected to change its configuration date. The game pulled in the 1940-01-01 that the Tambor has (??), and then failed to load a Tambor, instead giving me the Nautilus... sigh. I decided to try it anyway, and when the sun set, all looked fine, but when the moon rose about 0200, the moon did not shine, but the water reflected it, as if it was at 260T... If Saved the game, and all still loads fine, but the moon is still "off". I went ahead and exited again, and edited the mission file, correctly configuring the Tambor. When I went back into the game, and loaded the mission anew, with a Tambor boat, the moon was at about 020T, half-moon, and the water reflected it as such... So if anyone happens to notice issues, try to see what the moon and its reflection are doing... I have done this twice each now, and each time, same result - which with this game, basically "proves" nothing, but it might be a symptom...

In the meantime, with the multiple starts of this mission, I just now finished my "official test" mission's first two objectives of Patrol and Foto ReCon of Engebi, and I am now halfway to Guam... more later on this, and then I'll get back to what I call "The mazzi Test" with the Balao's guns...

I've read this and the later post about doing the entire mission. Somehow you found a LOT more traffic than I saw. More importantly, did your gauges continue to work properly? Mine went to 12 o'clock high as I had described.
I didn't notice anything to do with the Moon or its refection, didn't look at things like that.

What could be the difference here?

I'll probably go back to ground zero, pristine, del data files, etc etc .
Any other suggestions?

[propbeanie]

@ Mad Mardigan: I have pointed to Front Runner's posting Base Time 2018 for what he discovered time-wise in the game. I did a few experiments with him, and after we discovered the CareerStart problem for 1945, things became consistent. With a "properly configured" game clock, sunrise and sunset were consistent, and "yes", the game keeps you on your "base time". One thing we realized was that the game uses an even distribution of the time lines, placed upon the cylindrical world. As such, there is an apparent slight distortion that results, of the differences between the world as a globe and the world as a cylinder, similar to the Mercator effect. Therefore, days are close to the same length near the equator, as they are near the Tropic lines. There does appear to be some attempt by the game to simulate such differences, but it seems to be a single algorithm they used. One thing we noticed in this is that Pearl Harbor is not in its "historical" time zone, in which it was 30 minutes off (I cannot remember which way), such that if Midway was at 1400 hours, Pearl was at 1330. I also do not remember why they did that, and quick searches this morning have been futile.

I do not know how they actually programmed things, and Front Runner and I only guessed at how the clock (or probably "clocks") in the game are done. Rockin Robbins has always said that the game was lousy at its "astronomy", but it might just be the actual functioning of the game on each individual person's computer. If you are pretty well "tied" to 30fps, and your Saved files don't get contaminated or corrupted, then you should have very similar sunrise / sunset times, consistently through an entire career. If your computer is running at say 100fps, that's when using TC in the game tends to slightly 'confuse' the issue, and time "slips" a few minutes a day, one way or the other. One way to tell if you have a corrupted Save is with the clock, in that if when off the coast of Japan, and like you, you are having sunrise at 1030 hours, and that then changes to 0630 hours after a Save and then Load, then you know the Save lost some data somewhere, because you have changed from "Base Time", to "Local Time"...

Originally Posted by Gray Lensman

First I've heard of CapnScury's fix, so I've NEVER had it installed directly to the stock game, unless it actually is in TMO which I'll verify with some file comparisons. I've never had an issue with the stock game nor TMO losing the sonar mouse control AND whenever I switch mods, I completely wipe/blitz the entire installation which includes the JSGME MOD folder. along with the /SH4 folder where all the savegames and pertinent setup info are stored and then rebuild the installation with new mods There is NO cross-contamination in my games. At the moment, after 6 hours of playing TMO, knock on wood, I don't have even the glimmer of a glitch in the sonar mouse control. The problem almost assuredly appears to reside in FORTSU files.

Scurvy's fix is mostly for the Gato, and if you play Stock, it does not function correctly without Scurvy's fix. I do not recall if there was a version of the fix for TMO also, or if it was incorporated into v2.5... I cannot find reference to either. Also, just to clarify, I am not saying you are the one causing the issue. Windows 10 itself can "shell-out" and you might never see it. Something is corrupting your Save data though, while using FotRSU.

Originally Posted by WH4K

I seem to have stumbled upon another serious bug.

Returned to Midway in late November 1944. Was awarded an upgrade to the Tench class boat.

Accepted and set up loadout, crew etc for next patrol.

Cannot start next patrol. Whether I choose to start outside or inside of harbor, game crashes to desktop during loading.

Rebooted machine & restarted game a couple times, no change. Likewise, fullscreen vs. windowed mode.

If I go back to a save before returning to Midway & refuse the upgrade, I am able to start next patrol in the old Balao. But what fun is that?

As before, using only FOTRS:UE 1.24 + 1.26 patch.

The Tench is not an active submarine until January 1, 1945. Some of its equipment is not active until then either. As such, it is bascially and "unknown quantity" until after then. We can assume, from your experience, that it is not as forgiving as the Balao is when it comes to "early update", though most of my tests with getting it as early as October 1944 have successfully upgraded and gone out on patrol. Do you remember your mission assignment on the overview map, when you tried to do the first patrol? This could well be related though, to what mazzi found for the Balao and its deck gun, which is expanded to the Gato & Tench for the next release. All boats will have all guns, whether the boat is active before or after the gun. This includes the AA guns, so we'll see how their availability goes during testing also. I am in the process of running through all of the other equipment also. I expect my eyes to roll to the back of my head at any moment -

[Texas Red]

Originally Posted by WH4K

I seem to have stumbled upon another serious bug.

Returned to Midway in late November 1944. Was awarded an upgrade to the Tench class boat.

Accepted and set up loadout, crew etc for next patrol.

Cannot start next patrol. Whether I choose to start outside or inside of harbor, game crashes to desktop during loading.

Rebooted machine & restarted game a couple times, no change. Likewise, fullscreen vs. windowed mode.

If I go back to a save before returning to Midway & refuse the upgrade, I am able to start next patrol in the old Balao. But what fun is that?

As before, using only FOTRS:UE 1.24 + 1.26 patch.

I had that same issue a while back that ended my entire career. I accepted the offer in December of 1944 and yes it CTD'd for me. Like propbeanie said, the Tench is not an active boat until January of 1945. I updated my game, thinking that would work, but alas, it didn't. And I couldn't go back to deny the new upgrade, so I had been unoffically retired. Most aggravating thing in my time playing SH4, ever.

[mikesn9]

Fresh start, Pristine, delete Doc files, JSGME FORTSU 26P LAA.
Windows 7, 64bit
Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157
[C:\Ubisofdt\Wolves Of The Pacific\MODS]

100_FalloftheRisingSun_UltimateEdition_v1.24_EN
101_Patch_v1.2To_v1.26p



New career Tambor out of Pearl 12/9/41.


Mission to Marshalls patrol around Mili Atoll for "a few days"

Got there Dec 18 0100, went around and near everything there got no new objectives on radio or the list. No ships, no nothing. no completion.
Noticed on the map after 3 or more days, that west of me on Jaluit Atoll, there was "Objective 2" printed on the map. no star, no notification to me. checked it out, NADA. I tried sending messages a couple of times, but only got the "continue ..." message.
As of now I've there for 6 days... still no word.



Is there something missing in the game? Or in my head?

[Mad Mardigan]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

@ Mad Mardigan: I have pointed to Front Runner's posting Base Time 2018 for what he discovered time-wise in the game. I did a few experiments with him, and after we discovered the CareerStart problem for 1945, things became consistent. With a "properly configured" game clock, sunrise and sunset were consistent, and "yes", the game keeps you on your "base time". One thing we realized was that the game uses an even distribution of the time lines, placed upon the cylindrical world. As such, there is an apparent slight distortion that results, of the differences between the world as a globe and the world as a cylinder, similar to the Mercator effect. Therefore, days are close to the same length near the equator, as they are near the Tropic lines. There does appear to be some attempt by the game to simulate such differences, but it seems to be a single algorithm they used. One thing we noticed in this is that Pearl Harbor is not in its "historical" time zone, in which it was 30 minutes off (I cannot remember which way), such that if Midway was at 1400 hours, Pearl was at 1330. I also do not remember why they did that, and quick searches this morning have been futile.

I do not know how they actually programmed things, and Front Runner and I only guessed at how the clock (or probably "clocks") in the game are done. Rockin Robbins has always said that the game was lousy at its "astronomy", but it might just be the actual functioning of the game on each individual person's computer. If you are pretty well "tied" to 30fps, and your Saved files don't get contaminated or corrupted, then you should have very similar sunrise / sunset times, consistently through an entire career. If your computer is running at say 100fps, that's when using TC in the game tends to slightly 'confuse' the issue, and time "slips" a few minutes a day, one way or the other. One way to tell if you have a corrupted Save is with the clock, in that if when off the coast of Japan, and like you, you are having sunrise at 1030 hours, and that then changes to 0630 hours after a Save and then Load, then you know the Save lost some data somewhere, because you have changed from "Base Time", to "Local Time"...

propbeanie,

Ok, will keep that info in mind. Along with the fps being dogged down to 30fps, I also did a bit of side editing in the main.cfg file, found in Data\Cfg folder, to the section pertaining to '' [TIME COMPRESSION] '', as follows:

TimeStop=0
RealTime=1
LandProximity=128
CriticalDamage=1
CrewEfficiency=128;1
AirEnemyDetected=1
SoundEffects=128
CharacterAnim=64
EnemyDetected=1
RadioReport=1
Particles=64
PrayState=256
HunterState=256
3DRender=1024
Maximum=1024

Despite having max time or aka TC set to 1024, I rarely go beyond 1/2 of that, if even that high... I usually hang with speeding up to say, 128 maybe up to 256... rarely do I ever hit 512...

I do the editing of that file, before I even begin starting a career for the 1st time.


As it is, am slated to make way to area 11-B, on My 4th war patrol, & await further orders, which will take Me in that nearly same zone & will pay attention and see if sunrise hits at that same time as before... or not.

If it appears around the same time give or take a few minutes to follow the approximation of natural seasonal changes, seeing as how it is now in the 1st week of May that I am out on patrol.. the time the sun shows up, should if I have it right, should appear a few minutes later roughly around closer to 11'ish sub time... in the same long & lat cords... that I used before, which was just south'ish of Chiba, Japan.

On a side note, after trading up to a Gato, is it common, even though home ported at Pearl, to begin a patrol out of Midway.?

I ask, as right after being in the office & only to check to make sure all equipment, was as it should be (No, no changes made to the Tambor (sub I got was named 'Triton'), nor to the new boat I got awarded to transfer to... which was to the Gato, not just the class of subs... ironically After running that check, I then elected to begin patrol.

When all was said & done with loading to being on the sub (as it were, with NOT actually being on it... ) I noted that I was NOT in Pearl, or outside the entrance... but was instead, at Midway, in the port area... despite having chosen to start outside of Pearl. Normally, I choose to, for a sense of realism, start off docked inside the harbor... as skippers actually did & proceed to make way out of port.

If need be, I can go back into My save, right after docking from My 3rd patrol & see what occurs with choosing to go on patrol from the docks... your call, no problems doing so... I leave that for you to decide to advise done or not...

as a test run...

I've since started doing My saves the following way:

Mad-1A(to differentiate from 1 skipper career from another, I keep a note pad with the skippers name & code I use to keep track of them...) Ptrl-1 (notation of what patrol I am on, additional saves while on that same patrol, get the addition of B, C, D,.. etc., as needed at the end of the patrol # ex. Ptrl-1-B/Ptrl-1-C, etc., etc. et cetera...) 01/05/42 (following the date as is in game) 00:03 hrs (military time stamping... (as I did serve for a wee bit, back in My younger days... Reg. Army, ironic I know, considering I'm a USMC brat... ) in keeping with this being a military service sim...) so that save would like like without the added footnotes... as:

Mad-1A Ptrl-1 01/05/42 00:03 hrs

This avoids overwriting previous saves & any possibilities, I trust, for save contamination... that I know of, as I haven't ran into any yet... knock on wood...

Ok.. gonna stop here, before this becomes a novella...

Signing off...

M. M.

[Mad Mardigan]

Originally Posted by mikesn9

Fresh start, Pristine, delete Doc files, JSGME FORTSU 26P LAA.
Windows 7, 64bit
Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157
[C:\Ubisofdt\Wolves Of The Pacific\MODS]

100_FalloftheRisingSun_UltimateEdition_v1.24_EN
101_Patch_v1.2To_v1.26p



New career Tambor out of Pearl 12/9/41.


Mission to Marshalls patrol around Mili Atoll for "a few days"

Got there Dec 18 0100, went around and near everything there got no new objectives on radio or the list. No ships, no nothing. no completion.
Noticed on the map after 3 or more days, that west of me on Jaluit Atoll, there was "Objective 2" printed on the map. no star, no notification to me. checked it out, NADA. I tried sending messages a couple of times, but only got the "continue ..." message.
As of now I've there for 6 days... still no word.



Is there something missing in the game? Or in my head?

mikesn9

If that is the mission I think it is, you should get a completion tag for it, after patrolling the area for 5 days... that time begins the countdown, as soon as you boat edges into the green circle, if you have the add on mod that adds that circle around the area, I believe.. not sure what the radius is precisely... otherwise... I'd say somewhere in the 150 to 200 nm diameter.. rough guess... I did that mission on My 2nd patrol right out of the gate.. or was it on My 3rd... but know I did it... ahh yeah, was My 2nd objective (2nd patrol), right after doing an agent insertion, 2nd patrol... I completed dropping them off, radioed in & got that as the next to do... had to shake out the cob webs from the ol hd upstairs... Ironically, I was also in a Tambor class sub (see My previous post, right before yours)

Any deviation outside of that, will put the kibosh (aka pausing the clock) on the time clock, but.. as soon as you get back inside of that diameter area for that mission... the timer will start back up, right where it paused.

Hope this helps...

M. M.

[Gray Lensman]

Originally Posted by the beast

<snip>

...Most aggravating thing in my time playing SH4, ever.

LOL, The entire FORTSU mod has been the most aggravating thing in my time playing SH4. Graphics wise it looks fabulous, and the extra content is great, but looks can be deceiving and FORTSU is proving just that.

Just reading back thru the pages in this thread, you can read all the different issues with it, from wrong sub upgrade dates, to messed up bow gun add-ons, to the loss of the sonar mouse control. The list goes on.

The core problem from "my point of view" is this:

FORTSU was developed and assembled from at least 8 people, each great modders from their own standalone work. BUT all these mods they contributed failed to be meshed together properly in the FORTSU v1.24 upgrade, such that various conflicts keep manifesting as game stopping issues. propbeanie is trying to sort out these issues, but misses the irony in his blame statements regarding various reasons for the FORTSU mod to not be working for different people commenting here, since the entire FORTSU mega mod is made up of mixing mods together.

TMO was basically developed exclusively by ONE person. It's rather old, but in its basic installation, before adding additional mods, was virtually perfect. All it needs is some careful graphics and content "love" and it will blow the doors off FORTSU in its present condition.


edit> they have me listed as a closed beta tester, but the first time I ever messed with this mod was about 2 weeks ago, so this is my "beta" test and comment time, now.

[Moonlight]

Strange place to put a japanese gun emplacement Mr beanie, approximately 820nm East of Iwo Jima or roughly 154E by 24N.

Its a good job the night watch were alert as they spotted it first before it spotted us, we must not get scratches on the sub as it takes ages to paint the bloody thing.

[s7rikeback]

Hello Gray Lensman,

Most of the problems you have raised, are linked to stock, and previous edits

To this end, Over the last month or so, propbeanie has been neck deep in deck guns, sonar settings & sub upgrades, plus many other file edits.
I have been busy on other elements within the mod, mainly parent node ID conflicts, visual settings, graphics, external .DAT file names, and internal .dat file names, plus many other edits and fixes.

As you so elequently mentioned in your post, the mod team was far larger in it's first few years, and to this day, both myself and propbeanie are the only two permanent team members left.

Within a team, you have different strengths, when that frame-work erodes, those strengths leave, creating voids in knowledge and experiences.
We are both learning as we go in these area's and there is currently no quick-fix, when we change something, we then load the game, we test, edit, we load, we test and so on.

The next release is coming soon, and will come with noted exceptions, there will be No Add-On Mods included. This is something you also alluded too, and has been in the plans since the last version release.
We want to get to a secure base, before we bring back any mods, this now includes adding any more addtional mods or projects.



The version number may well change at the time of release, and once released, this will also be inline with a complete overhaul of the first page of the thread, to only show the needed information like the do's and don't - to get a more stable game play experience.

We are hoping that many of the &quot;fotRSU&quot; issues recently reported may have been fixed or are in a better state of play, what we cannot fix is people's desire to shell out, using high time compression, not using a clean install & clearing previous saves games when using a new version, not to add 3rd party mods, the list is endless, and these reasons are not being throw around without good reason, we have had these experiences in our own installs, as have many other gamers and modders alike.

We are aware there are inherent problems, as listed further above, please rest assured, we both are doing what we can, So please go and play TMO, and once your done, and you fancy retrying FotRSU, we will still be here, working for free, in our own time, and we just might be at a level where you expect us to be at.

[propbeanie]

Originally Posted by mikesn9

Fresh start, Pristine, delete Doc files, JSGME FORTSU 26P LAA.
Windows 7, 64bit
Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157
[C:\Ubisofdt\Wolves Of The Pacific\MODS]

100_FalloftheRisingSun_UltimateEdition_v1.24_EN
101_Patch_v1.2To_v1.26p



New career Tambor out of Pearl 12/9/41.


Mission to Marshalls patrol around Mili Atoll for "a few days"

Got there Dec 18 0100, went around and near everything there got no new objectives on radio or the list. No ships, no nothing. no completion.
Noticed on the map after 3 or more days, that west of me on Jaluit Atoll, there was "Objective 2" printed on the map. no star, no notification to me. checked it out, NADA. I tried sending messages a couple of times, but only got the "continue ..." message.
As of now I've there for 6 days... still no word.



Is there something missing in the game? Or in my head?

The patrol times are set to 4320 minutes, which is 3 days for both Mili Atoll and Jaluit Atoll, which is the next one you saw the circle draw for on December 20th. The next location will be S/E Truk, again for 4320 minutes. During the time you are patrolling, you must stay within the "designated area for three days". The designated area is a green circle on the map. I just did that mission again, traveling from Pearl with a December 10 departure, an arrival in the patrol zone almost exactly 8 days later, and a completion of the Objective 1 exactly 3 days later, where upon I was offered the new orders for Jaluit Atoll. After arriving there just before 1700 hours that same day, I drove about for three more days, finding absolutely nothing, just like you. The US sent submarines there, thinking that the Japanese had launched the Pearl Harbor attack from multiple locations in the area. After all, how could someone sneek all of the way across the Pacific Ocean, and surprise them, in spite of them not having long-range patrols out. It was inconceivable! It HAD to have come from the Marshalls, which were mandated to Japan after the conclusion of The Great War... It is not until a few months later (usually) that you will find much traffic in the Marshalls, except around Kwajalein and the like. So just stay within the circle for three days, and the Objective 1 should complete. The same for Objective 2 and Objective 3. If you have already done that, then your install and / or Save folder is borked, in spite of what others might say...

[propbeanie]

Originally Posted by Gray Lensman

LOL, The entire FORTSU mod has been the most aggravating thing in my time playing SH4. Graphics wise it looks fabulous, and the extra content is great, but looks can be deceiving and FORTSU is proving just that.

Just reading back thru the pages in this thread, you can read all the different issues with it, from wrong sub upgrade dates, to messed up bow gun add-ons, to the loss of the sonar mouse control. The list goes on.

The core problem from "my point of view" is this:

FORTSU was developed and assembled from at least 8 people, each great modders from their own standalone work. BUT all these mods they contributed failed to be meshed together properly in the FORTSU v1.24 upgrade, such that various conflicts keep manifesting as game stopping issues. propbeanie is trying to sort out these issues, but misses the irony in his blame statements regarding various reasons for the FORTSU mod to not be working for different people commenting here, since the entire FORTSU mega mod is made up of mixing mods together.

TMO was basically developed exclusively by ONE person. It's rather old, but in its basic installation, before adding additional mods, was virtually perfect. All it needs is some careful graphics and content "love" and it will blow the doors off FORTSU in its present condition.


edit> they have me listed as a closed beta tester, but the first time I ever messed with this mod was about 2 weeks ago, so this is my "beta" test and comment time, now.

Adding to what s7rikeback says, my "blame statements" have quite a bit of traction, thank you very much. Failure to properly clear the Save folder and failure to properly activate LAA are the two biggest issues we find. If it's not those, then its the mod, usually. What you are experiencing has not been reported much, if at all. I have never experienced sonar issues on the submarine, even after extensively abusing the game with high TC and shelling-out of the game, along with a few other "not recommended" practices. Besides the game not being easy to test, we have other aspects of living and breathing besides SH4. For the record, you are listed as a beta tester from back in the pre-beta days. You volunteered as such to Rockin Robbins. That would have been roughly 3+ years ago. As an aside, TMO was assembled by one person, but was parts from various other mods from other people. You might also notice the difference in the Air, Sea, Land and other folders, as FotRSU is quite a bit more extensive. The issues some have discovered, have been around since the days of the Stock game, such as the sonar issue you have. This is not a failure of the v1.24 to mesh, but rather a mis-match from the FOTRS / TMO days - oops, sorry, blaming again... As s7rikeback says, go play TMO. It is a good mod. But do NOT expect perfection from it either...

[propbeanie]

Originally Posted by Moonlight

Strange place to put a japanese gun emplacement Mr beanie, approximately 820nm East of Iwo Jima or roughly 154E by 24N.

Its a good job the night watch were alert as they spotted it first before it spotted us, we must not get scratches on the sub as it takes ages to paint the bloody thing.

You must be referring to Marcus Island, young man!




It is not named on the map, but was supposed to be... There are a couple of lifeguard missions off of there...

[Mad Mardigan]

To begin with, I missed seeing the mention of 'Mili', and as such... I stand corrected.

On My behalf, patrolling around the Marshalls, whilst I was in a Tambor class sub, the patrol I thought was the same as mikesn9's orders to ''New career Tambor out of Pearl 12/9/41 Mission to Marshalls patrol around'' was the same that I got.

Same sub class, same patrol begin date.... yet... this is where things veer off on a completely different, but somewhat similar ways... both are around the general Marshall islands... The orders I got, had Me patrolling off to the NW of the islands... where as mikesn9's, were for a specific set of them... if I have that area right in My old, dusty, some what beat up HD upstairs..

It was on THAT basis, when I responded back to mikesn9's post...

What I did mention, of the set amount of time & the amount of time on the clock for it to be tagged, as completed, does stand... you have to stay within the set diameter for the mission, &... if you deviate outside of that, then that clock, goes into lock down... aka it pauses... & will NOT resume until you go back into the set diameter of the mission for it to then resume the count down to completion.

That, as I know of... is a known factor or those such missions that tell you to patrol given point X ( X= whatever area is earmarked to be at) for X amount of time ( X= here, for the set length of time to complete the assignment) for the given length of time called for.

On mistaking the exact mission orders, I again... stand corrected...

On that, I apologize for dropping the ball...

M. M.

[Texas Red]

Originally Posted by Gray Lensman

LOL, The entire FORTSU mod has been the most aggravating thing in my time playing SH4. Graphics wise it looks fabulous, and the extra content is great, but looks can be deceiving and FORTSU is proving just that.

Wow, ok, no need to attack the devs.