[REL] Fall of the Rising Sun Ultimate, full release - Page 302

Jeff-Groves · 04-13-22, 10:16 AM

Pretty Crazy that that Bay is very nearly the opposite side of the Globe from Dunkirk.

In GWX 3 you get a CTD at Dunkirk!

I suspect a trans dimensional rip in the SH fabric of time.

Now it is documented here at SubSim some where that zooming into some areas in Map view will CTD.
SH3 anyway.

propbeanie · 04-13-22, 04:51 PM

Well, Jeff, I had almost forgotten about that and SH3... lol - I was wondering if maybe there aren't several errors in the "terrain" of the game, because of what can happen around Truk lagoon, or off the north shore of New Guinea, where no amount of terrain "fixing" will eliminate the under-sea "rift", where a sheer wall comes up from the thousands of feet deep, to be within 30feet of the surface. If you are submerged near the areas, you do not "crash" your boat, but rather, the game CTDs... I have tried all manner of attempted "fixes", including this "all-new" mission, of which this is the overview:

my Player sub is approaching the 24nm line I had drawn. I drew an 18nm circle from the other end, down by the Objective circles seen in the pic above, and was approaching that. This is the last pic taken, with an "X" about where my boat was when the game crashed - again:

The game is consistent with the four Commando Insertion missions I have built over the last two days, of crashing right at the 20nm mark from land. So I have blanked the campaign to eliminate all possibility of it being a unit of any sort. Date of the crash does not seem to matter, only the distance from the north shore of Attu, by Holtz Bay. The only "assets" I can find are two gun emplacements:

However, they look to be fine, and the game does still crash with that file removed anyway... I do have MapZones in use that span the 180 longitude, and thought maybe it was them, but removing them makes no difference. I have had issue when attempting to set waypoints for RGG or other Groups / Units in the game, if you "cross" the 180, where the Mission Editor will NOT go directly from WP1 to WP2 if on either side of 180, but rather, the route will "wrap around the world" instead... maybe this is related to that?... Dunno, but here's the set-up for that:

Also of interest is this:

If I exit the scenario prior to the CTD, the game still crashes - but only with this mission. I have a very similar mission off San Diego, another off Apemama, as well as other locations... It makes NO SENSE, unless I remember Dunkirk, and there is no explaining that one either...

I am now going to test coming North at Attu from west of the 180 line, and see what happens...

propbeanie · 04-14-22, 08:06 AM

In the interest of "science", and to gather data for further FotRSU trouble-shooting, I ran the same, almost exact, scenario in the Stock v1.5 of the game - no mods. The only changes to the mission are the removal of the APD Manley ships used in FotRSU, and the changing of the player submarine call to the Sargo. Same set-up as far as MapZones, Objectives and everything else. Here is the set-up coming in to the Holding Area, with the last radio messages displayed:

All is well. After going by the center of the 24nm circle, I started doing screen grabs every two thousand yards, to see how close to the FotRSU version any potential crash was. It never happened I quit after getting within 12nm of shore:

There we're coming in to line-up for the drops... No issues whatsoever, other than what the Stock game does to the boats in such high seas:

... and that is basically to put them under the player sub, no matter what you do to attempt to avoid them. I was always at a Reverse speed, and usually tried a right rudder to back away from the boats, but I did try several other settings to avoid them. They ended up under the sub all four times. Two of the four flipped upside down, turning turtle, as above, and show as "sunk ship" icons on the NavMap - but the Objectives all complete, so it is up to the Scouts to swim for shore, with all their gear... sigh - The third boat launched went northeast, instead of southwest for shore, so I am certain they were late for the engagement:

In the end though, the mission functioned as well as can be expected on the Bering Sea side of the Aleutians chain...

That leaves it to ~something~ in FotRSU... but what?...

KaleunMarco · 04-14-22, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by propbeanie

In the interest of "science", and to gather data for further FotRSU trouble-shooting, I ran the same, almost exact, scenario in the Stock v1.5 of the game - no mods.

That leaves it to ~something~ in FotRSU... but what?...

what you did was very good, scientifically.

so, what the results seem to indicate is that there is a condition within the mega-mod that SH4 is choking on.

a couple of questions about what you have tried to test so far:

did you run the original mission without the APD's? (i am considering the speed v turning radius v proximity to land of the APD's and their waypoints)
did you run the original mission without overlapping drop-off zones? (there could be something to the overlaps that SH4 is choking on. not saying would be expected/logical but this is, after all, an Ubi development.)
i have one other condition-question that i wanted to ask but i have forgotten it. if/when i remember i will post it.

propbeanie · 04-14-22, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

what you did was very good, scientifically.

Thanks

so, what the results seem to indicate is that there is a condition within the mega-mod that SH4 is choking on.

a couple of questions about what you have tried to test so far:

1. did you run the original mission without the APD's? (i am considering the speed v turning radius v proximity to land of the APD's and their waypoints) - Yes...
2. did you run the original mission without overlapping drop-off zones? (there could be something to the overlaps that SH4 is choking on. not saying would be expected/logical but this is, after all, an Ubi development.) - Yes - I have other similar missions with the same set-up in other locations, such as Carlson's Raiders, Apamama landings, San Diego Sea Trial, as well as most of the Insert / Rescue missions, etc...
3. i have one other condition-question that i wanted to ask but i have forgotten it. if/when i remember i will post it.

I read your mind and - an emphatic "Yes"... lol

For #1, I removed all aspects of the mis file, one by one, and tested between each removal of an item, whether a MapZone, Ship, Waypoint, Trigger, Event, Message, etc., or text of any sort, all the way down to just the Objectives, and then only the one of each in turn, whether just ObjOne, or through ObjFour. In all conditions, CTD was the answer...

For #2, The overlapping MapZones and triggers were removed, as noted above, one by one, whether used for an Objective, or a Trigger, until there was only the one for an Objective. Whatever the mission, CTD. ~HOWEVER~ - I could build a mission where my player submarine starts WEST of the IDL, and all would function as intended... That was my testing paradigm when adding the mission to the mod several years ago...

For #3, just post once you recover from your oldmanitis condition - it is contagious, btw...

For #4, after doing the mission down to just a single Objective on a MapZone, and that failing, changing boats, and that failing, etc., I went to the Campaign files, and "blanked" them, one-by-one, starting with my "primary suspect", the AleutiansTraffic.mis file, and tested - CTD. So then I went to the 42b files, one by one, and tested. Same resultant CTD each time. This is why it has taken days for all this testing. The Stock game functioning as intended lets me breathe a sigh of relief, because I was worried about what Jeff-Groves mentions above about Dunkirk in the GWX mod... I really do expect to find the issue. It's just a matter of time and patience...

I am starting further tests now in FotRSU, by "blanking" the entire campaign with the Campaign.cfg file, which will remove all aspects of all files, other than the mis file itself, and the configuratioins of the subs and environment. Smoke on the horizon does not indicate a specifically "bad" condition, but if you notice a mushroom cloud, seek immediate shelter...

propbeanie · 04-14-22, 12:41 PM

This is a good sign:

Although, you might notice that there is no "Ship spotted" or "Life Raft Spotted!" message, nor is there an indication on the NavMap of such, but at least the mission is functioning with an entirely "blank" campaign. It is liable to be a while before you hear back from me... one file at a time, and then test will take a while, especially if it is one of the last files that get added back in... sigh

KaleunMarco · 04-14-22, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by propbeanie

This is a good sign:

Yes. It. Is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by propbeanie

It is liable to be a while before you hear back from me... one file at a time, and then test will take a while, especially if it is one of the last files that get added back in... sigh

God willing, we'll still be here.

Jeff-Groves · 04-14-22, 05:19 PM

"because of what can happen around Truk lagoon, or off the north shore of New Guinea, where no amount of terrain "fixing" will eliminate the under-sea "rift", where a sheer wall comes up from the thousands of feet deep, to be within 30feet of the surface."

Would that "rift" near Truk Lagoon happen to be in the north west corner of that area?

propbeanie · 04-14-22, 06:14 PM

Indeed it is, Jeff. We did manage to 'correct' most of the issue there (including the Pillars of Unusual Size - PUS) by re-editing the Stock files with the GWX Terrain Extractor, and doing as Gap suggested back when, and saving to pdf format between editing sessions. We also stayed six pixels away from the edges, to prevent the "overlap" bug from not matching exactly between "bricks". However, even in Stock there are issues in the area that cannot-willnot allow repairs. Any noodling with the underwater "walls" in stock fails, including the massive one off New Guinea (aka: "The Morse Code Issue" - includes pictures!!! lol) - I could not find the original poster, but it can't be but a few pages earlier in the thread. Anyway, Stock SH4 does have undocumented "issues" (aka: "undocumented 'features'") that are not mentioned in the "Known Issues" portion of their ReadMe files... lol

"Diving" back into 194305NarwAttu testing...

Bubblehead1980 · 04-14-22, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff-Groves

"because of what can happen around Truk lagoon, or off the north shore of New Guinea, where no amount of terrain "fixing" will eliminate the under-sea "rift", where a sheer wall comes up from the thousands of feet deep, to be within 30feet of the surface."

Would that "rift" near Truk Lagoon happen to be in the north west corner of that area?

I call the "rift" off Truk a "Monument to UBI incompetence and laziness."

First time I saw that, I laughed, but since has just annoyed me. Too bad no one has been able to fix it though.

propbeanie · 04-14-22, 06:57 PM

The pillars are fixed in FotRSU. The vertical shift in elevation, like a very focused earthquake shift, was minimized. Most of it was from previous terrain edits in the area. Some however, are from Stock, and CANNOT be fixed, short of getting at their "source" of the problem, and the same for the "Morse Code" off of New Guinea. There is something inherently wrong in their original map data is my guess, where when they "wrapped" their Mercola terrain around the SH world's "toilet paper tube", they missed a few spots that needed "ironing" flat... lol

To the issue at hand though, with the CTD when approaching Attu for the 194305NarwAttu mission, I do have a primary "suspect" now, and that is "Jap_CoastalBattery.mis" - but I do not understand the issue, since the crash does NOT happen with a mission that is created with the boat starting in Holtz Bay... The two gun emplacements near there are apparently at issue, so we'll go that route next, and remove guns in the area, one by one now...

Jeff-Groves · 04-15-22, 01:41 AM

The "Morse Code" is gone.
Just edited the E141S002.RAW file.
I have files you might want to test as I did some editing of the BFD and BFI files.

I removed the garbage RL2 at E141S001 in the BDF and replaced it with a different RL2. Then corrected the size listed in the BFI.
Fired up a Quick Mission to do a visual and it's gone. Need to do a "Drive By" for a deep look.

I did look close at the removed RL2 file and it is a MESS! Reading the RL2 files in hex is REAL easy!
I may have to let ref's extractor run until it's fully converted. Last file was nearly 400,000 kb when I shut it down.
There might be a whole Globe in that file! Atlantis maybe?

Jeff-Groves · 04-15-22, 11:19 AM

Drive by and Deep dive tests completed!
No anomalies spotted. No CTDs.

Files uploaded for Suckers willing to test them.
If approved by the Sucke.... Subjects?
Can embed the E141S002 in the BFD and correct the BFI then make a patch file.
Patch would be a Massively smaller download.

!!HansGruber!! · 04-16-22, 07:08 AM

I'm struggling with awards in FotRSU. My understanding is completing objectives is most important towards earning awards. I returned from a patrol in March '43 (98/100 difficulty) where I completed 2 x 5 day grid patrols as well as successfully reporting multiple convoys which resulted in additional completed objectives for "Sink Enemy Merchant Vessel", "Attack Jap Task Force", and "Sink Large Troop Transports". All this resulted in the sinking of 129k tons including CV Shokaku. On return to port I receive a shiny Bronze Star.

I am enjoying the mod but this just seems odd.

propbeanie · 04-16-22, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff-Groves

The "Morse Code" is gone.
Just edited the E141S002.RAW file.
I have files you might want to test as I did some editing of the BDF and BFI files.

I removed the garbage RL2 at E141S001 in the BDF and replaced it with a different RL2. Then corrected the size listed in the BFI.
Fired up a Quick Mission to do a visual and it's gone. Need to do a "Drive By" for a deep look.

I did look close at the removed RL2 file and it is a MESS! Reading the RL2 files in hex is REAL easy!
I may have to let ref's extractor run until it's fully converted. Last file was nearly 400,000 kb when I shut it down.
There might be a whole Globe in that file! Atlantis maybe?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff-Groves

Drive by and Deep dive tests completed!
No anomalies spotted. No CTDs.

Files uploaded for Suckers willing to test them.
If approved by the Sucke.... Subjects?
Can embed the E141S002 in the BFD and correct the BFI then make a patch file.
Patch would be a Massively smaller download.

I had never thought of trying to hex edit the file... From what I remember, that particular "tile" was several times larger than all of its neighbors, which was why I was thinking it was a "seam" in the SH world... Anyway Jeff, I would like to have a copy of that E141S002.RAW file, and I can convert and integrate it on this end. That way, you're not having to send the whole shmear!...

04-13-22, 10:16 AM	#4516
Jeff-Groves Village Idiot Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 5,319 Downloads: 130 Uploads: 0	Pretty Crazy that that Bay is very nearly the opposite side of the Globe from Dunkirk. In GWX 3 you get a CTD at Dunkirk! I suspect a trans dimensional rip in the SH fabric of time. Now it is documented here at SubSim some where that zooming into some areas in Map view will CTD. SH3 anyway. __________________ I don't do Stupid. So don't ask.

04-13-22, 04:51 PM	#4517
propbeanie CTD - it's not just a job Join Date: May 2016 Location: One hour from Music City USA! Posts: 9,735 Downloads: 439 Uploads: 2	Well, Jeff, I had almost forgotten about that and SH3... lol - I was wondering if maybe there aren't several errors in the "terrain" of the game, because of what can happen around Truk lagoon, or off the north shore of New Guinea, where no amount of terrain "fixing" will eliminate the under-sea "rift", where a sheer wall comes up from the thousands of feet deep, to be within 30feet of the surface. If you are submerged near the areas, you do not "crash" your boat, but rather, the game CTDs... I have tried all manner of attempted "fixes", including this "all-new" mission, of which this is the overview: my Player sub is approaching the 24nm line I had drawn. I drew an 18nm circle from the other end, down by the Objective circles seen in the pic above, and was approaching that. This is the last pic taken, with an "X" about where my boat was when the game crashed - again: The game is consistent with the four Commando Insertion missions I have built over the last two days, of crashing right at the 20nm mark from land. So I have blanked the campaign to eliminate all possibility of it being a unit of any sort. Date of the crash does not seem to matter, only the distance from the north shore of Attu, by Holtz Bay. The only "assets" I can find are two gun emplacements: However, they look to be fine, and the game does still crash with that file removed anyway... I do have MapZones in use that span the 180 longitude, and thought maybe it was them, but removing them makes no difference. I have had issue when attempting to set waypoints for RGG or other Groups / Units in the game, if you "cross" the 180, where the Mission Editor will NOT go directly from WP1 to WP2 if on either side of 180, but rather, the route will "wrap around the world" instead... maybe this is related to that?... Dunno, but here's the set-up for that: Also of interest is this: If I exit the scenario prior to the CTD, the game still crashes - but only with this mission. I have a very similar mission off San Diego, another off Apemama, as well as other locations... It makes NO SENSE, unless I remember Dunkirk, and there is no explaining that one either... I am now going to test coming North at Attu from west of the 180 line, and see what happens... __________________ "...and bollocks to the naysayer/s" - Jimbuna

04-14-22, 08:06 AM	#4518
propbeanie CTD - it's not just a job Join Date: May 2016 Location: One hour from Music City USA! Posts: 9,735 Downloads: 439 Uploads: 2	In the interest of "science", and to gather data for further FotRSU trouble-shooting, I ran the same, almost exact, scenario in the Stock v1.5 of the game - no mods. The only changes to the mission are the removal of the APD Manley ships used in FotRSU, and the changing of the player submarine call to the Sargo. Same set-up as far as MapZones, Objectives and everything else. Here is the set-up coming in to the Holding Area, with the last radio messages displayed: All is well. After going by the center of the 24nm circle, I started doing screen grabs every two thousand yards, to see how close to the FotRSU version any potential crash was. It never happened I quit after getting within 12nm of shore: There we're coming in to line-up for the drops... No issues whatsoever, other than what the Stock game does to the boats in such high seas: ... and that is basically to put them under the player sub, no matter what you do to attempt to avoid them. I was always at a Reverse speed, and usually tried a right rudder to back away from the boats, but I did try several other settings to avoid them. They ended up under the sub all four times. Two of the four flipped upside down, turning turtle, as above, and show as "sunk ship" icons on the NavMap - but the Objectives all complete, so it is up to the Scouts to swim for shore, with all their gear... sigh - The third boat launched went northeast, instead of southwest for shore, so I am certain they were late for the engagement: In the end though, the mission functioned as well as can be expected on the Bering Sea side of the Aleutians chain... That leaves it to ~something~ in FotRSU... but what?... __________________ "...and bollocks to the naysayer/s" - Jimbuna

04-14-22, 12:41 PM	#4521
propbeanie CTD - it's not just a job Join Date: May 2016 Location: One hour from Music City USA! Posts: 9,735 Downloads: 439 Uploads: 2	This is a good sign: Although, you might notice that there is no "Ship spotted" or "Life Raft Spotted!" message, nor is there an indication on the NavMap of such, but at least the mission is functioning with an entirely "blank" campaign. It is liable to be a while before you hear back from me... one file at a time, and then test will take a while, especially if it is one of the last files that get added back in... sigh __________________ "...and bollocks to the naysayer/s" - Jimbuna

04-14-22, 05:19 PM	#4523
Jeff-Groves Village Idiot Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 5,319 Downloads: 130 Uploads: 0	"because of what can happen around Truk lagoon, or off the north shore of New Guinea, where no amount of terrain "fixing" will eliminate the under-sea "rift", where a sheer wall comes up from the thousands of feet deep, to be within 30feet of the surface." Would that "rift" near Truk Lagoon happen to be in the north west corner of that area? __________________ I don't do Stupid. So don't ask.

04-14-22, 06:14 PM	#4524
propbeanie CTD - it's not just a job Join Date: May 2016 Location: One hour from Music City USA! Posts: 9,735 Downloads: 439 Uploads: 2	Indeed it is, Jeff. We did manage to 'correct' most of the issue there (including the Pillars of Unusual Size - PUS) by re-editing the Stock files with the GWX Terrain Extractor, and doing as Gap suggested back when, and saving to pdf format between editing sessions. We also stayed six pixels away from the edges, to prevent the "overlap" bug from not matching exactly between "bricks". However, even in Stock there are issues in the area that cannot-willnot allow repairs. Any noodling with the underwater "walls" in stock fails, including the massive one off New Guinea (aka: "The Morse Code Issue" - includes pictures!!! lol) - I could not find the original poster, but it can't be but a few pages earlier in the thread. Anyway, Stock SH4 does have undocumented "issues" (aka: "undocumented 'features'") that are not mentioned in the "Known Issues" portion of their ReadMe files... lol "Diving" back into 194305NarwAttu testing... __________________ "...and bollocks to the naysayer/s" - Jimbuna

04-14-22, 06:57 PM	#4526
propbeanie CTD - it's not just a job Join Date: May 2016 Location: One hour from Music City USA! Posts: 9,735 Downloads: 439 Uploads: 2	The pillars are fixed in FotRSU. The vertical shift in elevation, like a very focused earthquake shift, was minimized. Most of it was from previous terrain edits in the area. Some however, are from Stock, and CANNOT be fixed, short of getting at their "source" of the problem, and the same for the "Morse Code" off of New Guinea. There is something inherently wrong in their original map data is my guess, where when they "wrapped" their Mercola terrain around the SH world's "toilet paper tube", they missed a few spots that needed "ironing" flat... lol To the issue at hand though, with the CTD when approaching Attu for the 194305NarwAttu mission, I do have a primary "suspect" now, and that is "Jap_CoastalBattery.mis" - but I do not understand the issue, since the crash does NOT happen with a mission that is created with the boat starting in Holtz Bay... The two gun emplacements near there are apparently at issue, so we'll go that route next, and remove guns in the area, one by one now... __________________ "...and bollocks to the naysayer/s" - Jimbuna

04-15-22, 01:41 AM	#4527
Jeff-Groves Village Idiot Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 5,319 Downloads: 130 Uploads: 0	The "Morse Code" is gone. Just edited the E141S002.RAW file. I have files you might want to test as I did some editing of the BFD and BFI files. I removed the garbage RL2 at E141S001 in the BDF and replaced it with a different RL2. Then corrected the size listed in the BFI. Fired up a Quick Mission to do a visual and it's gone. Need to do a "Drive By" for a deep look. I did look close at the removed RL2 file and it is a MESS! Reading the RL2 files in hex is REAL easy! I may have to let ref's extractor run until it's fully converted. Last file was nearly 400,000 kb when I shut it down. There might be a whole Globe in that file! Atlantis maybe? __________________ I don't do Stupid. So don't ask. Last edited by Jeff-Groves; 04-16-22 at 09:43 AM.

04-15-22, 11:19 AM	#4528
Jeff-Groves Village Idiot Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 5,319 Downloads: 130 Uploads: 0	Drive by and Deep dive tests completed! No anomalies spotted. No CTDs. Files uploaded for Suckers willing to test them. If approved by the Sucke.... Subjects? Can embed the E141S002 in the BFD and correct the BFI then make a patch file. Patch would be a Massively smaller download. __________________ I don't do Stupid. So don't ask.

04-16-22, 07:08 AM	#4529
!!HansGruber!! Watch Join Date: Oct 2021 Posts: 22 Downloads: 37 Uploads: 0	Awards I'm struggling with awards in FotRSU. My understanding is completing objectives is most important towards earning awards. I returned from a patrol in March '43 (98/100 difficulty) where I completed 2 x 5 day grid patrols as well as successfully reporting multiple convoys which resulted in additional completed objectives for "Sink Enemy Merchant Vessel", "Attack Jap Task Force", and "Sink Large Troop Transports". All this resulted in the sinking of 129k tons including CV Shokaku. On return to port I receive a shiny Bronze Star. I am enjoying the mod but this just seems odd.