Here we go again-Ukraine once again

[Jimbuna]

Kaczynski insists on transfer of Patriot air defense systems to Ukraine: "Germany will not dare to shoot down Russian missiles"

The head of Poland’s ruling Law and Justice (PIS) party, Jarosaw Kaczyski, believes that Germany will not dare to shoot down Russian missiles and insists on the transfer of Patriot air defense systems to Ukraine.

The politician's statement is quoted by Rzeczpospolita, Censor.NET reports with reference to LigaBusinessInform.

According to him, Patriots will be useful in war, but only where they will be used. He noted that Germany's position today does not give reason to believe that it would dare to shoot down Russian missiles.

Kaczyński said that placing air defense systems in the western regions of Ukraine would make it possible to protect Poland, as well as the infrastructure and citizens of Ukraine.

"Hence this proposal, which seems at least worthy of consideration by the Germans. If they want to give a weapon that is quite old, but still modern, then it should be used, it should not stand," he said.

The PIS leader believes that the proposal to transfer Patriot to Ukraine will be the most rational.

"The rockets that are here for beauty are a solution that can have aesthetic advantages. There are no military or political ones," Kaczynski summarized. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3383548

[Skybird]

The Ukraine and the Poles want to bring NATO into the war, lets not forget that.

Currently there is no sign in Germany that the Germans could be willing to send their Patriot battery directly to Ukraine.

Which is even understandable if you consider what I have posted about the German forces' ammo status in the Germany thread: https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/sho...postcount=1766

Germany is naked, has no ammo. A week ago or so I read that some BW source confirmed they have enough ammo for TWO DAYS of combat action at the intensity seen in Ukraine. And as things stand I predict this will not change significantly in coming years.

[mapuc]

Throughout my search for how good Patriot is I came to a section where it ask google

Which is the most advanced air Defence system? The answer was Iris-T

Which is the most advanced longrange air defence system ?The answer was Barak – 8 or MR-SAM.

Markus

[Dargo]

Originally Posted by Skybird

The Ukraine and the Poles want to bring NATO into the war, lets not forget that.

Currently there is no sign in Germany that the Germans could be willing to send their Patriot battery directly to Ukraine.

Which is even understandable if you consider what I have posted about the German forces' ammo status in the Germany thread: https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/sho...postcount=1766

Germany is naked, has no ammo. A week ago or so I read that some BW source confirmed they have enough ammo for TWO DAYS of combat action at the intensity seen in Ukraine. And as things stand I predict this will not change significantly in coming years.

Dutch have 1 day of ammo left also has Patriot batteries but will not send them across NATO borders with every NATO member resupplying their stock price go up and delivery will take much longer with this war.

[Dargo]

A student allegedly recently discharged from the Russian army in Ukraine says he was sent out with an old rifle. He also allegedly had to share his food and sleeping bag with other soldiers. Speaking to Reuters news agency, the boy says he was called up to fight in the Donetsk region, in eastern Ukraine, just before the invasion began.

"There were not enough sleeping bags for everyone, you could only cover yourself with a raincoat. We did eventually manage to cram two or three people into a sleeping bag to stay warm," said the boy. The rations were not enough for everyone at first, but later there was enough, he says.

Putin ordered this month that students must end their service, Reuters reports. Their intention would be to continue their studies. With the return of dozens of young men, that now seems to be heeded. The group was first honored today at a ceremony in the occupied Ukrainian city of Starobesheve, and then were reportedly sent home.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Throughout my search for how good Patriot is I came to a section where it ask google

Which is the most advanced air Defence system? The answer was Iris-T

Which is the most advanced longrange air defence system ?The answer was Barak – 8 or MR-SAM.

Markus

Only the Barak 8 ER qualifies as a long range air intercept missile (I think it was either 120 or 160km). The normal version of Barak-8 is only 30 or 40km. Its Israeli-Indian.

The German Iris-T SL(M) indeed is probably the most advanced short range SAM currently, a variant of a weapon developed as armament for the Eurofighter (an AA missle, therefore), and Ukraine reports hit rates of almost 100% against all target classes it was used on so far: planes, helicopter, drones. Perfect for point defence, but not strategic air space defence, therefore. A successor of the missile is already in development (LFK-NG), basing on the Iris-design, however.

[mapuc]

Iris-T is kind of not new to me.

As you wrote they were a part of Eurofighter as AA missile short range

The basic armament for JAS39 Gripen(Griffin) is:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saab_J..._and_armaments

Markus

[mapuc]

If I removed every friend on FB who is picking on Zelenskyj I would have almost zero Danish and Swedish friends.

Not only are they picking on Zelenskyj they are also expert in psychology they say Zelenskyj are showing psychopathic features

Makes me wonder they can put a diagnose on Zelenskyj, but can't make a diagnose on Putin.

Markus

[August]

Originally Posted by mapuc

If I removed every friend on FB who is picking on Zelenskyj I would have almost zero Danish and Swedish friends.

Not only are they picking on Zelenskyj they are also expert in psychology they say Zelenskyj are showing psychopathic features

Makes me wonder they can put a diagnose on Zelenskyj, but can't make a diagnose on Putin.

Markus

I have noticed the same thing over here Markus.

I have to wonder where all the extreme hate for this guy originates. Nobody I talk to can ever give me a reason that even approaches reality. Most involve some sort of character complaint, that he's crooked "Probably stole all of the money we have sent them", or he's just "a pretty boy actor who poses for magazine covers" when (apparently to them) he can not be a truly legit national leader unless he and his wife lived in a foxhole on the front lines.

The main thread in most of the anti-Zelenskis complaints seems to be that he and his wife are just in it for themselves, I have seen little or no actual evidence of this, but regardless his haters just refuse to acknowledge that Zelenski now walks around with an enormous target on his back.

If Ukraine looses this war Zelenski is a dead man, probably his family as well. Even if they win he will still be in danger, because by resisting he has now pissed off the most powerful man on the European continent, one that wants him eliminated and has a history of getting revenge on a cold dish. The haters refuse to understand that Zelenski could have easily run with the money way back when Russia first attacked and avoided that fate. Instead he doesn't abandon his people and he stays in country ducking air raids and bombs (and in his case hit squads) like everyone else. Doesn't sound very self serving to me.

Bidens support for Ukraine is about the one thing he is doing right in my eyes, and I sometimes wonder if because it's his admin doing it, that is the real reason that some of us over here favor letting a nation of 44 million people become enslaved by the Russians. Leaving them subject to the ethnic cleansing and genocide that we all know will happen if Putin and company manage to take control over the country.

This isn't Afghanistan or Vietnam where we are the ones doing the fighting and dying for someone else's cause. The Ukrainians are doing their own fighting and dying and it's not for some esoteric political or social cause that we foisted upon them but their own national survival.

There is nothing wrong or improper in giving a free people the means to continue resisting brutal aggression from a powerful and ruthless neighbor. It's less than France and Holland did for us in our own Revolutionary War.

[Commander Wallace]

^ @ August @ Markus. I read what you and Markus had to say on Zelensky. To be blunt, the complainers or those who malign Zelensky are those who can't think for themselves. They are like the woman in Florida in the thread that Platapus posted. People like this aren't happy unless they are complaining or whining about something.

People should keep in mind, Zelensky was in show business as a comedian. This comedian rallied his country and countrymen to fend off attacks by what on paper is a superior force. This reminds me of the saying. It's not the size of the dog in the fight but the size of the fight in the dog that is fighting. In my humble opinion, the tactics and strategy utilized by the Ukraine will be analyzed for many years on how to fight a " superior " force. I think Zelensky has done an awesome job.

As you said, Zelensky has his rear end on the line as our fore fathers did in fighting for American independence and for the ideals we still hold as the backbone of our Republic. I see a lot of similarities in the nature of ours and the Ukraine's struggles. I also see many similarities in the character and fortitude in the founders of our Republic and those leading the Ukraine and fighting everyday for their country and it's freedom.

Edit. If the complainers or those who malign Zelensky don't like things or have a better idea, they need to be handed a rifle and directed to the front. That way, they can show us their better ideas.

[August]

I'm impressed by their will to fight.

[Commander Wallace]

Originally Posted by August

I'm impressed by their will to fight.

Would we as Americans do any less if our country or loved ones were at risk or in danger ? Count me as also impressed with the resolve of the Ukraine people and armed forces.

[August]

Originally Posted by Commander Wallace

Would we as Americans do any less if our country or loved ones were at risk or in danger ? Count me as also impressed with the resolve of the Ukraine people and armed forces.

[nikimcbee]

Originally Posted by August

I'm impressed by their will to fight.

Interesting video. I was wondering, how many snipers were lurking around, whilst they filmed that? the reporter needs to upgrade her camo from blue to tan.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Commander Wallace

Count me as also impressed with the resolve of the Ukraine people and armed forces.

Oh yes. Yes, yes, yes.