A rant

Penelope_Grey · 01-27-08, 04:51 PM

Ok this I don't get at all... I can take off and land a jumbo jet in a high winds in FSX... yet in IL2 I can't even get the sucker to lift off even on nice days, heaven only knows what I would do in mid air.

Another thing that winds me up a treat about IL2 is that you can't actually click stuff in the cockpit to operate things... so you really do have to memorise the keyboard and that aint an easy task there are sooo many buttons... honest to god, how do you play this thing?

Its like trying to dig a ditch with a teaspoon!!

I know I said I was going to learn but this is like trying to learn photoshop a learning curve like a hook!

End transmission.

Skybird · 01-27-08, 05:07 PM

I would say a good HOTAS and a clever keymapping is almost as much a must as are rudder pedals in IL2. TrackIR is nice, but goes third only.

What is your stick and throttle?

If you have FSX, get an addon aircraft with 1-2 undercarriage configuration, or even an old fighter to practice landings and takeoffs - in these regards I always considered IL2 to be a bit weired, or strange. If FSX includes a default acrobatics plane, you have a good chance that that has the old undercarriage configuration as well.

Penelope_Grey · 01-27-08, 05:14 PM

Well thanks for that Skybird, but whats a HOTAS?

I think FSX is just plain different to IL2 so all my practicing in FSX for flight basics... the so called realistic simulator were for nought.

Skybird · 01-27-08, 05:32 PM

HOTAS: hands on throttle and stick. It is a combo of stick and throttle with many buttons on them, famous devices are Cougar, Saitek X-somenumber, and CH gear. You program keyboard functions onto the buttons and that way can call up to dozens of commands without needing to use the keyboard, which is nice when being in the middle of a fight. Also, if not using TrackIR, you can put padlock commands onto your device, which helps enormously to maintain SA. You use them blindly, like a musician plays the sax without looking at the buttons.

Oh, SA. Situational Awareness.

I have a Spitfire, a BF109 and a Hurricane for FS9, and muist say their flightmodel is less hectic, less hypersensitive and more believable than in IL2. while the flight dynamics in IL2 are showing plenty of diversity and in that regard serve their purpose, I never were too enthusiastic about them. I find them feeling "too light", and almost hysteric for most planes. Callibration of input sensitivity must be conducted with great care and lot of expermenting. My favourite plane in IL2 was the Hurricane, for that reason. for IL2, it had not enough "bite", though.

Landing and taking off with a 1-2 and 2-1 gear confoguration makes big differences in how it is done, and even how you manage to keep on the runway when you can't see anything at the front. Landing is done faster, but not as steep with an old WWII fighter. It is easy to bounce, but hard to land, and they had more accidents for that reason back then. I found it very helpful to practice all this in FS8 and then going back to IL2 - the training really helped me immensely.

You should try it, if you have problems with landing and taking off. that way you get a better image of how it should be done, ideally. there are free downloads for a good hurricane and BF109 available, including virtual cockpits. search this foirum, i or somebody else have posted links some months ago. Or buy a package. for the soitfrire, there are several good packages available. I choosed the one by RealAir. chances are there is an acrobatic plane in FSX included - that maybe will have a 2-1 gear configuration, like older aircraft of WWII.

I do not fly IL2 much anymore. It seems my years when I enjoyed to be in the middle of a hectic messup are over, and the flight models and functionality simply do not give me what I am now looking for in a flightsim. These days I prefer co0mplex functionality beasts with hundreds of systems, lights and switches, or acrobatics. Currently heading for a dedicated soaring simulation.

danlisa · 01-27-08, 05:53 PM

LOL Pen. IL2 is so much easier to grasp the basics of than MS FS.

To take off in IL2:

Press (I) to start engine
Apply Take Off Flaps (F x2)
Apply parking Brake (B press & hold)
Power up throttle (about 80-90%)
Release brake (take finger off B)
Apply left/right rudder (as required, easy if you have a twisty joystick)
Power up to 100%
As you accelerate, your tail will bounce, apply some forward tilt on the joystick to lift your tail.
When you hit approx 100kph, start to pull up.
When airbourne, retract gear & raise flaps (V x2)

You're now flying.

As for there being too many keys to remember, well, after awhile you learn what you need and even then during dogfights, you'll only need a fraction of what's available.

Failing that, the best way to learn is jump in with the lads. They'll get you airbourne very quickly. I think we had Jim in the air after the first couple of tries.

Penelope_Grey · 01-27-08, 06:04 PM

No, its embarassing to suck at something in front of people. At least I can suck in private and not feel that bad.

I don't have a twisty joystick, but I actually crashed the plane while on the ground! I didn't know it was possible to crash a plane and be on the ground.

NiclDoe · 01-27-08, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penelope_Grey

Well thanks for that Skybird, but whats a HOTAS?

I think FSX is just plain different to IL2 so all my practicing in FSX for flight basics... the so called realistic simulator were for nought.

Dont worry about it just fly normally and fly with us we need a sexy ledy to fly with us

Kratos · 01-28-08, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Dont worry about it just fly normally and fly with us we need a sexy ledy to fly with us

settle down there man-cub...Its your aircraft thats suppose to take you to great heights not your hormones.

Dowly · 01-28-08, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kratos

Quote:

Dont worry about it just fly normally and fly with us we need a sexy ledy to fly with us

settle down there man-cub...Its your aircraft thats suppose to take you to great heights not your hormones.

:rotfl:

NiclDoe · 01-28-08, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kratos

Quote:

Dont worry about it just fly normally and fly with us we need a sexy ledy to fly with us

settle down there man-cub...Its your aircraft thats suppose to take you to great heights not your hormones.

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

Dowly · 01-27-08, 06:45 PM

Skybird is right, a joystick with a twist handle for the rudder is almost as important as the joystick itself. My old old old joystick didnt have the twist handle and with a bit of luck, I maybe got 2 kills a mission, bombers mainly. Not much of a change against fighters.

Penelope_Grey · 01-27-08, 06:49 PM

Thanks for the tips... I suppose I best invest...

oh well I got the game for £3 can't have it all ways.

XabbaRus · 01-27-08, 07:28 PM

Pen get a cyborg evo no need to get the force feedback one. It is a good stick and the price is good.

kylesplanet · 01-28-08, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penelope_Grey

Ok this I don't get at all... I can take off and land a jumbo jet in a high winds in FSX... yet in IL2 I can't even get the sucker to lift off even on nice days, heaven only knows what I would do in mid air.

Another thing that winds me up a treat about IL2 is that you can't actually click stuff in the cockpit to operate things... so you really do have to memorise the keyboard and that aint an easy task there are sooo many buttons... honest to god, how do you play this thing?

Its like trying to dig a ditch with a teaspoon!!

I know I said I was going to learn but this is like trying to learn photoshop a learning curve like a hook!

End transmission.

I just got IL2 two days ago and I'm as lost as you, probably more. I forgeting you can't click anything and I really miss my 2D panel.

I will admit I have had a ball riding around in a B-25 bomber, switching to different positions in the plane, I really like being in the top gun turrett if there are some bad guys close enough and playing bombadier. Maybe we'll figure it out.:hmm:

FIREWALL · 01-29-08, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penelope_Grey

Ok this I don't get at all... I can take off and land a jumbo jet in a high winds in FSX... yet in IL2 I can't even get the sucker to lift off even on nice days, heaven only knows what I would do in mid air.

Another thing that winds me up a treat about IL2 is that you can't actually click stuff in the cockpit to operate things... so you really do have to memorise the keyboard and that aint an easy task there are sooo many buttons... honest to god, how do you play this thing?

Its like trying to dig a ditch with a teaspoon!!

I know I said I was going to learn but this is like trying to learn photoshop a learning curve like a hook!

End transmission.

What joystick do you have ?

01-27-08, 04:51 PM	#1
Penelope_Grey Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: UK Posts: 1,893 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	A rant Ok this I don't get at all... I can take off and land a jumbo jet in a high winds in FSX... yet in IL2 I can't even get the sucker to lift off even on nice days, heaven only knows what I would do in mid air. Another thing that winds me up a treat about IL2 is that you can't actually click stuff in the cockpit to operate things... so you really do have to memorise the keyboard and that aint an easy task there are sooo many buttons... honest to god, how do you play this thing? Its like trying to dig a ditch with a teaspoon!! I know I said I was going to learn but this is like trying to learn photoshop a learning curve like a hook! End transmission. __________________ I SURVIVED THE FIRST EVER SUBSIM WEREWOLF HUNT - and... I actually won the game for the humans too!

01-27-08, 05:07 PM	#2
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 40,604 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	I would say a good HOTAS and a clever keymapping is almost as much a must as are rudder pedals in IL2. TrackIR is nice, but goes third only. What is your stick and throttle? If you have FSX, get an addon aircraft with 1-2 undercarriage configuration, or even an old fighter to practice landings and takeoffs - in these regards I always considered IL2 to be a bit weired, or strange. If FSX includes a default acrobatics plane, you have a good chance that that has the old undercarriage configuration as well. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-27-08, 05:14 PM	#3
Penelope_Grey Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: UK Posts: 1,893 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Well thanks for that Skybird, but whats a HOTAS? I think FSX is just plain different to IL2 so all my practicing in FSX for flight basics... the so called realistic simulator were for nought. __________________ I SURVIVED THE FIRST EVER SUBSIM WEREWOLF HUNT - and... I actually won the game for the humans too!

01-27-08, 05:32 PM	#4
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 40,604 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	HOTAS: hands on throttle and stick. It is a combo of stick and throttle with many buttons on them, famous devices are Cougar, Saitek X-somenumber, and CH gear. You program keyboard functions onto the buttons and that way can call up to dozens of commands without needing to use the keyboard, which is nice when being in the middle of a fight. Also, if not using TrackIR, you can put padlock commands onto your device, which helps enormously to maintain SA. You use them blindly, like a musician plays the sax without looking at the buttons. Oh, SA. Situational Awareness. I have a Spitfire, a BF109 and a Hurricane for FS9, and muist say their flightmodel is less hectic, less hypersensitive and more believable than in IL2. while the flight dynamics in IL2 are showing plenty of diversity and in that regard serve their purpose, I never were too enthusiastic about them. I find them feeling "too light", and almost hysteric for most planes. Callibration of input sensitivity must be conducted with great care and lot of expermenting. My favourite plane in IL2 was the Hurricane, for that reason. for IL2, it had not enough "bite", though. Landing and taking off with a 1-2 and 2-1 gear confoguration makes big differences in how it is done, and even how you manage to keep on the runway when you can't see anything at the front. Landing is done faster, but not as steep with an old WWII fighter. It is easy to bounce, but hard to land, and they had more accidents for that reason back then. I found it very helpful to practice all this in FS8 and then going back to IL2 - the training really helped me immensely. You should try it, if you have problems with landing and taking off. that way you get a better image of how it should be done, ideally. there are free downloads for a good hurricane and BF109 available, including virtual cockpits. search this foirum, i or somebody else have posted links some months ago. Or buy a package. for the soitfrire, there are several good packages available. I choosed the one by RealAir. chances are there is an acrobatic plane in FSX included - that maybe will have a 2-1 gear configuration, like older aircraft of WWII. I do not fly IL2 much anymore. It seems my years when I enjoyed to be in the middle of a hectic messup are over, and the flight models and functionality simply do not give me what I am now looking for in a flightsim. These days I prefer co0mplex functionality beasts with hundreds of systems, lights and switches, or acrobatics. Currently heading for a dedicated soaring simulation. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-27-08, 05:53 PM	#5
danlisa Navy Seal Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Cornwall, UK Posts: 5,499 Downloads: 45 Uploads: 1	LOL Pen. IL2 is so much easier to grasp the basics of than MS FS. To take off in IL2: Press (I) to start engine Apply Take Off Flaps (F x2) Apply parking Brake (B press & hold) Power up throttle (about 80-90%) Release brake (take finger off B) Apply left/right rudder (as required, easy if you have a twisty joystick) Power up to 100% As you accelerate, your tail will bounce, apply some forward tilt on the joystick to lift your tail. When you hit approx 100kph, start to pull up. When airbourne, retract gear & raise flaps (V x2) You're now flying. As for there being too many keys to remember, well, after awhile you learn what you need and even then during dogfights, you'll only need a fraction of what's available. Failing that, the best way to learn is jump in with the lads. They'll get you airbourne very quickly. I think we had Jim in the air after the first couple of tries. __________________

01-27-08, 06:04 PM	#6
Penelope_Grey Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: UK Posts: 1,893 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	No, its embarassing to suck at something in front of people. At least I can suck in private and not feel that bad. I don't have a twisty joystick, but I actually crashed the plane while on the ground! I didn't know it was possible to crash a plane and be on the ground. __________________ I SURVIVED THE FIRST EVER SUBSIM WEREWOLF HUNT - and... I actually won the game for the humans too!

01-27-08, 06:45 PM	#11
Dowly Lucky Jack Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 25,005 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	Skybird is right, a joystick with a twist handle for the rudder is almost as important as the joystick itself. My old old old joystick didnt have the twist handle and with a bit of luck, I maybe got 2 kills a mission, bombers mainly. Not much of a change against fighters.

01-27-08, 06:49 PM	#12
Penelope_Grey Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: UK Posts: 1,893 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Thanks for the tips... I suppose I best invest... oh well I got the game for £3 can't have it all ways. __________________ I SURVIVED THE FIRST EVER SUBSIM WEREWOLF HUNT - and... I actually won the game for the humans too!

01-27-08, 07:28 PM	#13
XabbaRus Navy Seal Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 5,330 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Pen get a cyborg evo no need to get the force feedback one. It is a good stick and the price is good. __________________