[REL] Fall of the Rising Sun Ultimate, full release

[propbeanie]

Originally Posted by Larrywb57

Yes, the ships are in single file with DE Tachibanna class leading, Anastasia Maru second, the Hostital ship at third, fourth is CH 28 Class Sub Chaser and in last place, the Taito Maru, which is the one that is riding high and wobbling side to side, which is possibly from a few broken cases of Sake.

Bingo! We might have a WINNER!!! er, uh, loser, I suppose... but you say they were single-file?? rats... The chaser should not be in front of the Taito Maru... did you observe them much, such that you saw that subchaser weave in and out of the convoy, causing mayhem as it cuts in front of ships, and then end up in the rear again??

Originally Posted by Imarider

Hello, all. I have the question, there are ships patroling close to harbours in JapanHarborTrafic.mis files, they deleting on last waypoint and spawn again in repeat interval (as i understand). Why not just loop the last waypoint and set the same (900h) interval as docked ships, is it have influence on game performance?

Yes, they do not loop ad infinitum ad naueum in FotRSU, since you end up with the same thing all of the time. SH4 does not use resources the way SH3 does, and only loads what it is using when the player boat is within range to spawn the 3D world. Docked ships should not be set to 900hr intervals, since you end up with multiple spawns all occupying in the same spot. In FotRSU, we set the spawn cycle to the length of time for the layer, hence a one year time frame will (in theory) only generate one ship and one ship only in 8760 hours. At the end of the cycle, a new file loads, and the time frame changes. If you are experiencing lag near harbors, that happens anywhere an area is busy, no matter how you set the groups and units up. The game will lag when it generates the 3D objects, which kind of gives a clue then that you are within roughly 32km of something. The more TC you use, the more you notice it. It is recommended to not use more than 2048x TC at any one time, and when you get into a busy area, you might have to not exceed 128x to keep from having the game stutter.

[Imarider]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

Yes, they do not loop ad infinitum ad naueum in FotRSU, since you end up with the same thing all of the time. SH4 does not use resources the way SH3 does, and only loads what it is using when the player boat is within range to spawn the 3D world. Docked ships should not be set to 900hr intervals, since you end up with multiple spawns all occupying in the same spot. In FotRSU, we set the spawn cycle to the length of time for the layer, hence a one year time frame will (in theory) only generate one ship and one ship only in 8760 hours. At the end of the cycle, a new file loads, and the time frame changes. If you are experiencing lag near harbors, that happens anywhere an area is busy, no matter how you set the groups and units up. The game will lag when it generates the 3D objects, which kind of gives a clue then that you are within roughly 32km of something. The more TC you use, the more you notice it. It is recommended to not use more than 2048x TC at any one time, and when you get into a busy area, you might have to not exceed 128x to keep from having the game stutter.

I'm not familiar with SH3 engine (as SH4 too), i'm using the files from Nippon Maru, there are 6 harbour traffic files divided on time intervals, and docked ships set to 900 hr, and ships patrolling near harbours set to about 24-48 hr with checked "delete on last waypoint" button. So, if i will make the ships patrolling near harbours with looped trajectory and set them to 900 (or 8760 whatewer) with unchecked "delete on last waypoint" instead of set to 24 hr with checked "delete on last waypoint" button , will it have much influence on game performance (possibility CTD)? Another question, if i uncheck "docked" button for harbour warships and my submarine will be spotted by those, will they attack me with DC?

[propbeanie]

The thing to do if you're going to set a group to loop is to set to the time period of the layer, such that 41a runs from November 1, 1941 to February 28, 1942, which is 120 or 121 days (yes, the game does do leap years), or 2904 hours (174,240 minutes). The 42a runs for a year, so 365 days, or 8760 hours (525,600 minutes). Those should be your minimums, so that you do not generate more than one of any given group during the run of the layer. Of course, in some places, it wouldn't hurt to have a couple patrols running about a harbor, but if you notice, there are multiple patrols that do already run through some areas... You should not notice a difference in performance. It would be basically the same, since the unit is tracked in the database until you come within spawn range, and it is then generated in 3D. Similarly with the docked ships. You should not have more than one spawning per layer. That was the reason we split the Jap_HarborTraffic file into separate "layers" of 41a, 42a, 42b, 43a, 44a, 44b, just like most of the other files. For the next release, we are doing similar with the US_HarborTraffic file. Doing such eliminates (if done correctly ), multiple spawns occupying the same space.

As for unchecking the DockedShip=true flag, that would allow some of the PC type craft to come after you. We used to have some set that way, but not very many. They have a tendency to wander off on their own afterwards, and will travel about the globe, actually traveling through the polar ice caps, rounding the world in perpetuity... ~THAT~ will adversely effect the game efficiency, and eventually cause a CTD from having so many ships driving around on their own volition. You definitely want to avoid that. You can however, set a ship with waypoints, but have it set to zero (0) knots where you place it. I cannot remember, but you might have to set the first waypoint to zero also, else the ship will average between the zero at origination, and whatever the first waypoint is... I cannot remember that detail.

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by Imarider

Hello, all. I have the question, there are ships patroling close to harbours in JapanHarborTrafic.mis files, they deleting on last waypoint and spawn again in repeat interval (as i understand). Why not just loop the last waypoint and set the same (900h) interval as docked ships, is it have influence on game performance?

good question.

some modders do as you suggest however the game forces an end point for a group such as you are referring.

so...whether a modder loops a group to retrace its steps or just sets on a one-way trip, it must end somewhere.

another factor is that the game keeps time from an absolute date point, like 9/1/1939 or something similar. so, when a modder defines a group, he must also define the date range of the spawn, the max number of ships the group can contain, the max number of spawns that the group can make, the speed per waypoint (think on that), the spawn rate of each member-ship of of the group and a few more qualities that i cannot remember at this point. the time-date-keeping will drive modders crazy, especially when they attempt to re-create a historical setting such as the Battle of the Coral Sea or Midway, or Doolittle's raid, etc.

so, in the end, it is faster/better/easier for a modder to create a group, mark out the waypoints in either a one-way trip or a round trip and let it go.

does that help?

[Larrywb57]

Bingo! We might have a WINNER!!! er, uh, loser, I suppose... but you say they were single-file?? rats... The chaser should not be in front of the Taito Maru... did you observe them much, such that you saw that subchaser weave in and out of the convoy, causing mayhem as it cuts in front of ships, and then end up in the rear again??

I observed as I chased them down and set up for an attack on the next leg. I still have it saved. I'll reload and get back to you later this weekend.

LB

[Imarider]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

The thing to do if you're going to set a group to loop is to set to the time period of the layer, such that 41a runs from November 1, 1941 to February 28, 1942, which is 120 or 121 days (yes, the game does do leap years), or 2904 hours (174,240 minutes). The 42a runs for a year, so 365 days, or 8760 hours (525,600 minutes). Those should be your minimums, so that you do not generate more than one of any given group during the run of the layer. Of course, in some places, it wouldn't hurt to have a couple patrols running about a harbor, but if you notice, there are multiple patrols that do already run through some areas... You should not notice a difference in performance. It would be basically the same, since the unit is tracked in the database until you come within spawn range, and it is then generated in 3D. Similarly with the docked ships. You should not have more than one spawning per layer. That was the reason we split the Jap_HarborTraffic file into separate "layers" of 41a, 42a, 42b, 43a, 44a, 44b, just like most of the other files. For the next release, we are doing similar with the US_HarborTraffic file. Doing such eliminates (if done correctly ), multiple spawns occupying the same space.

As for unchecking the DockedShip=true flag, that would allow some of the PC type craft to come after you. We used to have some set that way, but not very many. They have a tendency to wander off on their own afterwards, and will travel about the globe, actually traveling through the polar ice caps, rounding the world in perpetuity... ~THAT~ will adversely effect the game efficiency, and eventually cause a CTD from having so many ships driving around on their own volition. You definitely want to avoid that. You can however, set a ship with waypoints, but have it set to zero (0) knots where you place it. I cannot remember, but you might have to set the first waypoint to zero also, else the ship will average between the zero at origination, and whatever the first waypoint is... I cannot remember that detail.

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

good question.

some modders do as you suggest however the game forces an end point for a group such as you are referring.

so...whether a modder loops a group to retrace its steps or just sets on a one-way trip, it must end somewhere.

another factor is that the game keeps time from an absolute date point, like 9/1/1939 or something similar. so, when a modder defines a group, he must also define the date range of the spawn, the max number of ships the group can contain, the max number of spawns that the group can make, the speed per waypoint (think on that), the spawn rate of each member-ship of of the group and a few more qualities that i cannot remember at this point. the time-date-keeping will drive modders crazy, especially when they attempt to re-create a historical setting such as the Battle of the Coral Sea or Midway, or Doolittle's raid, etc.

so, in the end, it is faster/better/easier for a modder to create a group, mark out the waypoints in either a one-way trip or a round trip and let it go.

does that help?

Sure, that help. If be based on file 41a_Jap_HarborTraffic.mis from Nippon Maru, that i'm looking now, docked ships have "Repeat interval" = 900 hours and "Max group instances created" = 1, and there are "Entry date" and Exit date", then, how i understand, 900 hours is time which enough for one patrol and each time you start new patrol the game create new base with those ships, so they don't overlap. Am i right or no? But, what i don't understand, why ships which close to harbors, not those that travel far, have about 24 hr repeat interval and many instances created instead just have then the same interval and 1 instance? If there are no overlapping with docked ships, for example, if you have patrol between dates on two files, then "Exit date" delete group (or ship) and load new one, and no need to delete it other way? I understand that for far routs it useful, but for ships just protecting harbours is it need, if not performance problem?

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

...the game forces an end point for a group...

Or just an end point is needed becouse otherwise the game or save will crash?

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by Imarider

Sure, that help. If be based on file 41a_Jap_HarborTraffic.mis from Nippon Maru, that i'm looking now, docked ships have "Repeat interval" = 900 hours and "Max group instances created" = 1, and there are "Entry date" and Exit date", then, how i understand, 900 hours is time which enough for one patrol and each time you start new patrol the game create new base with those ships, so they not overlap. Am i right or no? But, what i don't understand, why ships which close to harbors, not those that travel far, have about 24 hr repeat interval and many instances created instead just have then the same interval and 1 instance? If there are no overlapping with docked ships, for example, if you have patrol between dates on two files, then "Exit date" delete group (or ship) and load new one, and no need to delete it other way? I understand that for far routs it useful, but for ships just protecting harbours is it need, if not performance problem?

in your example above, the max group instances =1 will prevent any repeats. so, you could enter any number in the repeat interval (or several other fields) and those values would be ignored because there will only be one occurrence of that RGG.

Originally Posted by Imarider

Or just an end point is needed because otherwise the game or save will crash?

no, no crash, the design of the game is such that if a unit has a waypoint it must also have an endpoint.
it is what it is. to file a complaint, dial 1-800-UbiCaresNot.

[Imarider]

Ok, looks like i got the point. Any travelling ship (except the named ships) must have a few instances becouse if you sunk it, it have to be respawned, say, for next patrol, but as docked ships not move, they cannot be deleted, then they have just 1 instance for layer. Big thanks to Propbeanie and KaleunMarco for help .

I thought, may be it's simplier just to make the ship like corvette patroling inside the harbour to protect it, how it affect a performance and possible CTD? I just didn't see it in any SH modification.

[Larrywb57]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

Bingo! We might have a WINNER!!! er, uh, loser, I suppose... but you say they were single-file?? rats... The chaser should not be in front of the Taito Maru... did you observe them much, such that you saw that subchaser weave in and out of the convoy, causing mayhem as it cuts in front of ships, and then end up in the rear again??

YES! I also think that is the convey. A few hours earlier, I had came across a conyey in two columns being lead by a DE with a hospital ship trailing. A tanker, three cargo maru in the middle. I set up an attack on the tanker and three torpedoes later she when down. As the tanker was going down, here came another DE from the same general direction as the convey, looking for me. Later I sunk a cargo maru. After the hunt for the submarine was over and no other ships around, drove to periscope depth and stopped. Save the game. At this time, no ships were displaying odd behaviors. Then real life events got in the way. Came back after a couple of weeks, loaded the last save. I had forgotten about two ealier attacks. On my way to my last objective, came across a convey in single file with one maru, Taito maru, listing from starboard to port side and keel almost out of the water. The ships were the same class minus the ones I sunk. Thanks for your patience with me.

Hey all!

Love this mod right up my alley, dark nights, like the way the hull on the conning tower blocks the view of the binocs. Realistic convoy routes are great of course. Had a great patrol from Fremantle Australia (my home town of Perth BTW originally)

As usual with early war SH4 careers - I sank mainly single ships in my Patrol zone first mission startling July 1942 (out of Fremantle as mentioned.) Headed back for the long journey home from Convoy College to home port of Freo, within 10 or so nm of port outside the red circle on the navmap the game CTD with no error message. I tried going back to my previous save slowing time compression to 64x when 100 nm out of home port but no luck, that save put me way back in the Java sea.
Have included a screenshot of my JSGME
running the 4gig patch also

The only thing I can think is I didn't apply the 1.8f upc patch before starting a patrol. But does this make a difference, if no then what could be causing this dock CTD?

Cheers,
Kick

[Larrywb57]

Bingo! We might have a WINNER!!! er, uh, loser, I suppose... but you say they were single-file?? rats... The chaser should not be in front of the Taito Maru... did you observe them much, such that you saw that subchaser weave in and out of the convoy, causing mayhem as it cuts in front of ships, and then end up in the rear again??

No Sir, no weaving in or out of the convoy. It looked like the Taito Maru was having a difficult time keeping up.

[propbeanie]

Originally Posted by kickswitch

Hey all!

Love this mod right up my alley, dark nights, like the way the hull on the conning tower blocks the view of the binocs. Realistic convoy routes are great of course. Had a great patrol from Fremantle Australia (my home town of Perth BTW originally)

As usual with early war SH4 careers - I sank mainly single ships in my Patrol zone first mission startling July 1942 (out of Fremantle as mentioned.) Headed back for the long journey home from Convoy College to home port of Freo, within 10 or so nm of port outside the red circle on the navmap the game CTD with no error message. I tried going back to my previous save slowing time compression to 64x when 100 nm out of home port but no luck, that save put me way back in the Java sea.
Have included a screenshot of my JSGME
running the 4gig patch also

The only thing I can think is I didn't apply the 1.8f upc patch before starting a patrol. But does this make a difference, if no then what could be causing this dock CTD?

Cheers,
Kick

The 1.8 patch should not matter in what you have encountered (though it does fix other items). We did have an issue coming back in with one of the classes (Sargo?? Salmon??) in v1.7, but that was repaired in v1.8. Plus, it happened further out, or when you went to dock and end patrol. Did you happen to clear the Save folder prior to starting SH4 with FotRSU activated?

Originally Posted by Larrywb57

No Sir, no weaving in or out of the convoy. It looked like the Taito Maru was having a difficult time keeping up.

My guess is that as you entered the game from your Save, that one of the escorts was cutting between the ships as it spawned, and that caused a bad spawn. It is the nature of the beast unfortunately, and is the way the game responds to a problem, such as collision avoidance. Try to avoid looking at the ugly beast, otherwise, you might catch the ugly...

[clone155]

Hello. I just finished installing this mod, and I love it so far. One issue I have though is that the map icons don't display ship direction anymore. Is there a way to change that?

[propbeanie]

Originally Posted by clone155

Hello. I just finished installing this mod, and I love it so far. One issue I have though is that the map icons don't display ship direction anymore. Is there a way to change that?

Those are the map.cfg file in conjunction with the lines files. You cannot be using any of the TMO "dot" mods nor the 450_MoonlightzSonarLines mod from the add-on modz pak, but use this instead:

450c Nunya_EZ_Plot.7z

mod last in your mods list with JSGME, and you should get colored sonar lines and the tails back.

[KaleunMarco]

i am still baffled by the inconsistency of the game with regards to conning tower upgrades.

i have seen upgrades awarded after 5 or 6 missions with 1 or 2 rating but i just completed mission 18 in a Porpoise and no MidWar upgrade or LateWar Upgrade.

last six mission were solid ones(1). (as opposed to gelatinous ones or gaseous ones)

baffling.