[REL] Fall of the Rising Sun Ultimate, full release

[propbeanie]

knock knock - who is there? - Old - old who? - Jeff, that's who!

The years, they are FLYING!!!

[Jeff-Groves]

And who is this Jeff?

Oh. Wait. I think thats me.

[hunter301]

Been here since 2003.
Can remember playing SH3 on a little 14" monitor trying to read the numbers on the TDC controls.

Now it's much easier to see them on a 49" UHD/4K screen...

[propbeanie]

How well I remember those days. I do not remember how big the analog RGB monitor was (10"?? 12"??) for my C-64 (still have it) for Up Periscope and a few other titles were (oh! 2x floppy disk Hunt For Red October!), but I do remember the 14 inch RGB for my SH1, SH2, SH3, SH4 & SH5... lol - it was still being used just a few years ago. I also had a few 17" analog monitors... - I cannot remember half of the subsim titles I have downstairs... Nothing beats SH1 though, other than the campaign and graphics (and modding) of SH4 - but SH1 still has several items better than SH4. My favorite for the German side has always been Aces of the Deep. Ubi has dropped the ball multiple times in this game. "Fumles and loses the ball on the 2 yard line!!! What a heartbreak!!!"

[KaleunMarco]

so, the SD radar sucks and fails to pick up a couple of Tony's on patrol.
we crash dive as soon as the lookouts spot them.
we are under the surface but not too deep when the Tony's open up with their 20's. i assume they are 20's because they sound like 20's.
they score some hits and we take 100% hull damage.
that's not right.

[propbeanie]

I don't know what's going on there, but in my install, the SD will p/u around 10k yds, the SD Improved will do about 12k yds, and the SV will do 14k, roughly - little more little less... unless the sea is rough, there's fog or rain, or any one of a number of different scenarios. One thing that I have seen happen is I'll get a "Radar contact, bearing 109" or whatever, see a little marker (map contacts on), and it then might drop-out, only to be replaced by a red triangle about 3 or 4 minutes later. "Sorry sir, tube went out!" Are you supplementing your SD with SJ? You almost have to, or use the APR, but if a plane doesn't have radar, then you're sunk also... (I know, bad pun)

The Tony in FotRSU carries 3x 100kg bombs (historical??) and 2x 40mm cannons (not historical). The 40mm was used since the 20mm in the game is NOT a cannon. There are also the wing MGs, and there are several "BombDummy" so that the plane will do multiple strafing passes on you. Definitely not something to tangle with. Do you have APR yet?

From the wunnerfull wunnerfull Wikipedia:

Armament
Guns:
2× 20 mm (0.79 in) Ho-5 cannon, 120 rounds per gun each
2× 12.7 mm (0.50 in) Ho-103 machine guns, 250 rpg each
Bombs:
2× 250 kg (550 lb) bombs

We'll look into the SD more though. I'm still editing Support folder files, s7rikeback is still working on NM and NK compliance, while vickers03 is working on Interiors compliance, so we'll be a couple days anyway before the next release.

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

I don't know what's going on there, but in my install, the SD will p/u around 10k yds, the SD Improved will do about 12k yds, and the SV will do 14k, roughly - little more little less... unless the sea is rough, there's fog or rain, or any one of a number of different scenarios. One thing that I have seen happen is I'll get a "Radar contact, bearing 109" or whatever, see a little marker (map contacts on), and it then might drop-out, only to be replaced by a red triangle about 3 or 4 minutes later. "Sorry sir, tube went out!" Are you supplementing your SD with SJ?

SD-1 and SV at the moment. i still do not know exactly how that f6cker got so close before we detected him.

Originally Posted by propbeanie

The Tony in FotRSU carries 3x 100kg bombs (historical??) and 2x 40mm cannons (not historical). The 40mm was used since the 20mm in the game is NOT a cannon. There are also the wing MGs, and there are several "BombDummy" so that the plane will do multiple strafing passes on you. Definitely not something to tangle with. Do you have APR yet?

nobody really had airborne 40mm during the war. the Nazi's had a couple of late-models armed with 30mm and those were devastating.
but i understand your reasoning for putting the 40's into some planes. i don't like it but i understand it.

i do have the APR installed but we have not detected any radar to date, which makes me wonder if it is working. i seem to remember that there is no on/off switch, you install it and it operates. or do i remember incorrectly?

[propbeanie]

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

SD-1 and SV at the moment. i still do not know exactly how that f6cker got so close before we detected him.

That's the beauty of CapnScurvy's "bandwidth" tuning, if you have some "chop" to the ocean. You are sometimes above, and sometimes below the 'target' with the beam. There is also the chance of "skipping" a rotation, so combined, as I mentioned, I have had a plane detected at 10nm, it disappears, and then the next warning is visual contact. If you're in a Narwhal Class, you are in trouble with a Tony. Good, fast airplanes - but not much armor.

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

nobody really had airborne 40mm during the war. the Nazi's had a couple of late-models armed with 30mm and those were devastating.
but i understand your reasoning for putting the 40's into some planes. i don't like it but i understand it.

i do have the APR installed but we have not detected any radar to date, which makes me wonder if it is working. i seem to remember that there is no on/off switch, you install it and it operates. or do i remember incorrectly?

We really should try to make an appropriate ammo for a 20mm cannon, something stronger than the a plain bullet, yet not as strong as a 40mm explosion... - We also need a 30mm cannon for the PT boats... lol

As for the APR, not too many planes have radar, and only certain locations have those, such as Rabaul and the larger bases. That would be the long-range planes, like some of the Betty planes, or the H6K Mavis or H8K Emily, and a few others. Seems to me that the Judy might get it later, as well as a few other single-engined planes, but usually the multi-crewed planes. The Tony never gets it (if I remember correctly...)

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

That's the beauty of CapnScurvy's "bandwidth" tuning, if you have some "chop" to the ocean. You are sometimes above, and sometimes below the 'target' with the beam. There is also the chance of "skipping" a rotation, so combined, as I mentioned, I have had a plane detected at 10nm, it disappears, and then the next warning is visual contact. If you're in a Narwhal Class, you are in trouble with a Tony. Good, fast airplanes - but not much armor.



We really should try to make an appropriate ammo for a 20mm cannon, something stronger than the a plain bullet, yet not as strong as a 40mm explosion... - We also need a 30mm cannon for the PT boats... lol

As for the APR, not too many planes have radar, and only certain locations have those, such as Rabaul and the larger bases. That would be the long-range planes, like some of the Betty planes, or the H6K Mavis or H8K Emily, and a few others. Seems to me that the Judy might get it later, as well as a few other single-engined planes, but usually the multi-crewed planes. The Tony never gets it (if I remember correctly...)

yeah, that's all very interesting, but we never detect surface radar. i mean never. and we are into April 1945. someone in the IJN had to have a radar set at sea. (lol)

now, having had my fun, i believe we are being detected via radar but the APR is not giving us any warning.
i've posted previously that DD-escorts have detected me before i detect them, in clear weather and fair seas, and that is not proper.
I'm referring to DD's, not Frigates and not DE's and not the scows with guns, DD's.
so there is detection afoot on their side but not by the APR. Hey...wait....what if....is it possible....that Ubi designed the APR?

[propbeanie]

Well... April 1945, but which boat are you in. Also, what "targeting" are you using? It is really kind of irritating, but you CANNOT do any TMO-style targeting, nor FotRSU either, if you want to do proper APR tracking. You NEED TO USE Moonlight's Sonar Lines, so that you get the Blue for warship, Black for merchant and other, and GREEN (almost black) for the Radar detected. You should also see something to the effect of "Radar signals detected, bearing xxx (whatever)" in the text box, very similar to a sonar detection, and you should then see a dark Green line on the NavMap. It does NOT stay around like the sonar (hydrophone) line usually, because the radar tends to rotate its "focus", and it will fade faster, like a radar contact. One of the MAJOR problems with the game is the AI Sensors. You can only use ONE AT A TIME (sorry for all of the "shouting"). ie: If you have a radar contact showing on your screen, you will lose a sonar contact. If you then "see" the contact, you lose the radar contact... so, if you have your radar on, and have a radar contact, you do lose the APR contact. For ships - if I am remembering this correctly, you might get an APR contact first (green line), then the sonar (black line), then the radar (box on NavMap - IF you have contacts on), then the visual. In each case, as you "step through" the sensors, you lose the previous. Kind of like trying to do an end-around on the edge of visibility, and losing the visual, but getting a sonar or radar contact shortly after. But the game plays it like the Japanese have the best huff-duff (HF/DF) and best radar detection on the planet, even in their smaller planes, and can "home-in" on your boat with relative ease. We've been trying to turn that down ever since beta release 0.1 back in 2016... sigh

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

Well... April 1945, but which boat are you in. Also, what "targeting" are you using? It is really kind of irritating, but you CANNOT do any TMO-style targeting, nor FotRSU either, if you want to do proper APR tracking. You NEED TO USE Moonlight's Sonar Lines, so that you get the Blue for warship, Black for merchant and other, and GREEN (almost black) for the Radar detected. You should also see something to the effect of "Radar signals detected, bearing xxx (whatever)" in the text box, very similar to a sonar detection, and you should then see a dark Green line on the NavMap. It does NOT stay around like the sonar (hydrophone) line usually, because the radar tends to rotate its "focus", and it will fade faster, like a radar contact. One of the MAJOR problems with the game is the AI Sensors. You can only use ONE AT A TIME (sorry for all of the "shouting"). ie: If you have a radar contact showing on your screen, you will lose a sonar contact. If you then "see" the contact, you lose the radar contact... so, if you have your radar on, and have a radar contact, you do lose the APR contact. For ships - if I am remembering this correctly, you might get an APR contact first (green line), then the sonar (black line), then the radar (box on NavMap - IF you have contacts on), then the visual. In each case, as you "step through" the sensors, you lose the previous. Kind of like trying to do an end-around on the edge of visibility, and losing the visual, but getting a sonar or radar contact shortly after. But the game plays it like the Japanese have the best huff-duff (HF/DF) and best radar detection on the planet, even in their smaller planes, and can "home-in" on your boat with relative ease. We've been trying to turn that down ever since beta release 0.1 back in 2016... sigh

auto-targeting.
driving a Balao.
with APR enabled i am expecting to see something like: "Radar signals detected, bearing xxx (whatever)" in the orders box but it does not appear.
i am not sure what you mean by: You can only use ONE (sensor) AT A TIME.
i have never turned off sensors unless i was playing DW and i encountered Allied forces with HF-DF and then i turned off the radar set. and i do not think you can ever turn off the hydrophone unless you clear out the Attack Room and i cannot do that.

ok. i have enabled the Moonlight mod. i hope it has stock-like contact symbols.

[propbeanie]

No no... the ~game~ can only use one sensor at a time. Next time you approach a convoy, notice (with Moonlight's mod) the "lines" as you approach - IF the APR is functioning correctly - you should see an APR "Radar signals detected bearing..." message (if they have radar), then you might see "sonar contact, bearing..." (unless it's a plane, of course), but notice that any APR green line is now a black (or blue) sonar line. A bit later, you would get your "Radar contact, bearing..." and the sonar line goes away. When the "painted" target comes into visual range, you will see the radar contact fade away. So it's not you that does the changing, it is the game and its little infantile brain only able to use one sensor at a time ("oh look! a thumb!"). This is also why you do NOT get warned when a DD suddenly turns toward your sub, and the only way you find out about it is when the 5" inch shells punch a hole in the after torpedo room "We're under attack, sir!" Is that Sherlock?? "Well, we told you about it just a short while ago, and figured you had your eye on it"...

I did most of my tests with the APR in the Balao and Gato, so it ~should~ function correctly. I still haven't run through the files though. Surely, something didn't get lost in the translation...

[hunter301]

While we're on the subject of sensors I'm playing the "Wounded Bear" mission in the FOTRSu using the Tambor class submarine. I been running on the surface from Freemantle to Darwin the whole time except for a couple of test dives down to 300' and I can't seem to get my SD radar to turn on.
What's up with that?

Also I ran full out to get to Darwin because I know I have to catch the carrier before it gets back to the home islands and I want to top out my fuel tanks in Darwin. I know I've seen it done in campaigns but I don't know how to access to controls to do it in the single mission if it exist.

[propbeanie]

Look in the game's root folder after you have FotRSU activated, and you will find that the "SH4_Q-Ref_Card_Back.jpg" and "SH4_Q-Ref_Card_Front.jpg" files have been edited by CapnScurvy, and rather nicely too! The "T" key is what toggles the SD on and off. Press the Alt and T key, and the SJ (if available) turns on and off. The SJ "automatically turns on each time you surface, so if you do not want that on continuously, you will have to watch that, and the SD once on, stays on. Once off, stays off. Unlike TMO, the mast does not extend. Most of the keypresses are listed in those files, with the Front being the keyboard image, and the Back being the keys listed by grouping.

As for Wounded Bear, if I remember correctly (not at the game right now) is mid-1942, and Darwin was bombed into oblivion in February, and would still be out of service as far as a base for fueling goes. The Wounded Bear does not go that fast, so you should be able to catch it at Ahead Full, and if you do use Ahead Flank, FotRSU does not do the fuel usage very realistically, in spite of what "Estimated range at current speed" might say. You should see some "Contact Reports" coming in, tracking Wounded Bear. To throw you off though, there are other groups that also report in... and the Bear does not always follow the same path... For a little fun a while back, I ran the scenario in stock as a test, and made a pdf of the adventure:

The Hunt For Wounded Bear

I don't remember if Google Drive will let you view the pdf online, or if you have to download it to view it...

[hunter301]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

Look in the game's root folder after you have FotRSU activated, and you will find that the "SH4_Q-Ref_Card_Back.jpg" and "SH4_Q-Ref_Card_Front.jpg" files have been edited by CapnScurvy, and rather nicely too! The "T" key is what toggles the SD on and off. Press the Alt and T key, and the SJ (if available) turns on and off. The SJ "automatically turns on each time you surface, so if you do not want that on continuously, you will have to watch that, and the SD once on, stays on. Once off, stays off. Unlike TMO, the mast does not extend. Most of the keypresses are listed in those files, with the Front being the keyboard image, and the Back being the keys listed by grouping.

As for Wounded Bear, if I remember correctly (not at the game right now) is mid-1942, and Darwin was bombed into oblivion in February, and would still be out of service as far as a base for fueling goes. The Wounded Bear does not go that fast, so you should be able to catch it at Ahead Full, and if you do use Ahead Flank, FotRSU does not do the fuel usage very realistically, in spite of what "Estimated range at current speed" might say. You should see some "Contact Reports" coming in, tracking Wounded Bear. To throw you off though, there are other groups that also report in... and the Bear does not always follow the same path... For a little fun a while back, I ran the scenario in stock as a test, and made a pdf of the adventure:

The Hunt For Wounded Bear

I don't remember if Google Drive will let you view the pdf online, or if you have to download it to view it...

Been using the T key to bring it online and all though the crew member /narrator of the game tells me it's online when I go to it I see nothing in the scope.

Was able to download and save your .pdf to my external HD I keep for game videos and such will read it at work tomorrow...LOL.

As for refueling in ports under normal circumstances how would this take place?