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Old 03-01-13, 07:46 PM   #1
GoldenRivet
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Default Microsoft Flight and SHO...

these two titles have been repetitively compared to one another... largely because they are both simulator style titles that have switched to a "free to play" format.

one thing that i just realized about Microsoft flight that brought on a new bit of something to think about...

Microsoft flight, in its newly downloaded "free" condition, offers one island of Hawaii to fly from, for about $20 you could upgrade to the entire Hawaiian island chain. Want to fly to California, Tour Europe?

too bad

you cant in Microsoft flight for any price because these areas of the world are not simulated in any way not even through DLC or a payware expansion pack

additionally microsoft flight offers only a couple of flyable aircraft in its free condition. each additional aircraft cost money - in some cases as much as $10+ each

this meant that the full version of flight simulator X with dozens of flyable aircraft, AI traffic, virtually every known airport in the world, dynamic real time downloadable weather and all the bells and whistles was about $60

However... Microsoft flight - once upgraded to 5 flyable aircraft and the hawaiian islands with no weather, no traffic, no AI etc was about $50

this got me to thinking.

What if Silent Hunter Online allows you to play in the north sea and into the north atlantic about as far as the western coastal areas of Great Britain?

want more? you have to pay $20 to get the western approaches out to the mid atlantic?

gibralter? $15

the med? $10

drumbeat along the eastern US? $15

thoughts?
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Old 03-02-13, 04:27 AM   #2
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I believe the devs have stated that all content in the game is available through hard work and patience however you can purchase items to speed things up.
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Old 03-02-13, 05:36 AM   #3
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A model like WoT? Pay to win? Pay to be the best? Pay to be ahead of your rivals?
It works for WoT, so why not here.
But it still wouldn't get me to play the game
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Old 03-02-13, 08:04 AM   #4
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In this game of course there are no human rivals unless you are talking about the leaderboard of course, as all players are on the same side against the Allied AI.

I think they should have gone for a full 3d client rather than a Flash based browser game though, that is a very limiting nonsensical decision in terms of graphics and future growth and does not increase the potential audience reach in any great way.
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Old 03-02-13, 11:23 AM   #5
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let alone... no ability to mod the game.

one of the big attractions to the flight simulator series, is that users can acquire software to create their own scenery, or create their own aircraft etc.

if you wanted to model your own home or your favorite attraction that wasnt in the sim, you could do this with some relative ease.

additionally, Silent Hunter's appeal, or at least a portion of it comes in the ability for users to modify their experience, even if this is done with a bit more difficulty than the flight simulator series.

Take the GWX mod for example.

If ubisoft looked at their sales data of shelved copies of SHIII in the few months following the release of GWX, i would wager that they would at least see a noticeable uptick in sales.

I suppose the real lasting difference between a sim and a game is that a game is meant to entertain

a sim is meant to entertain and inspire.
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Old 03-06-13, 02:13 AM   #6
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Its funny how out of touch most people are with this concept..

Its called "Micro-transactions"

Here is the easiest way to explain it.

You two types of players who will have the advantage with these types of games.

A. The nerd who is willing and able to put in hours and hours, EACH day.

B. The rich guy, or the person willing to spends hundreds of real money.

What about the third guy, like me and most of us here? C, in a second..

The best example of MT games, is of course, World of Tanks.

There have been games before WoT, but its the first true example.

Here is where C. comes into play, us.. We can play the game for free, we might even enjoy it, because, well its free and does have some value. The problem is, if you want to get into it a little deeper, you will start to see the horrible flaws.

Group A and B are going to dominate you in every possible way, you are not willing to spend tons of money and you don't have the time to put in to gain the points (That could otherwise be bought) so you will always lag behind.

Now, many may think that its not the case, that group C. can compete and be part of groups A and B. I promise you would be wrong. The companies are not in it for fun, they are not in it to give people value for nothing, the game will be designed in every way to get you to either , HAVE or WANT to pay.

WoT was fun, I even paid about 40 bucks within a months time, I was competing and hanging with the big boys, but before you knew it, just like a great machine, I was behind once again. I either needed to put in tons of hours or pay up again.

After reading into it and talking with many others, I realized there were people that were spending hundreds each month, I even heard of someone spending 3k bucks in 60 days... He had the best tanks, best armor, best shells.

Now of course you would think someone that spends 3k would be ontop and completely dominate everyone, while its kind of true, because the company is going to REWARD those who spend, the company also built the best machine, so that eventually even the person that spend thousands will still crave more.

It turned me and many other people away from that game, I wasn't willing to spend the money nor do I have the time.

Many people can handle playing every so often and be fine, after all there is supposed to be a ranking system, but I promise, its not you and 40 other people like you, they have the groups A and B mixed in there. It got to a point where you could literally be hull to hull with another tank and do nothing to it.

But heres the best part.. WoT is a huge success, the company is making money hand of fist and rightfully so, I wish I thought of something like that.

But what sucks.. Many games followed, they saw the success and wanted in on it.

Here are some..

Age of Empires, great series, loved the game to death.. I downloaded the new one.. Age of Empires, ONLINE.. And just like the other MT games, you get sucked in but at some point you hit that wall.. Age of Empires Online isn't as bad as others but you still have a group A and B player group.

War Thunder, AKA World of Plane (not the same as World of Tanks, although they have one coming out, called World of WARplanes, but made World of planes change there name, so its called War Thunder)

Same thing, don't need to go into details.. Want a P-51, want high octane? gotta pay for it. and so on.

Some games that have been around for a long time, have variations of MT.. Diablo III came out not long ago and while the MT part is unique, its still within the core of the game..

I heard EA will be coming out with all MT games, ONLY, in the future.

Its a huge hit, there are tons of idiots out there, they don't even realize how much they actually pay after all said and done.

I had no problem spending 60 bucks on a game, after all its well deserved, but since when did games start to cost thousands??

When Major online games came out, like EverQuest, or World of Warcraft, 10-15 bucks a month, but that was it, no more no less. It was a subscription and you were part of a huge online server.. It was understandable.

Many companies see the issue with it, there is a game that I love called League of Legends.. A VERY VERY competitive game, to the point they have tournaments with the winning team getting 100+ thousand bucks..

But, everyone even the top guys are on an even level playing field.. Its MT, but the only stuff you buy is skins for the characters.. You think they wouldn't do good without something to entice players to have an advantage, but it works,lol..

As for "Microsoft Flight"

Its a horrible joke,let alone its a complete arcade game, the pricing is horrible.. 30 bucks for some packages and 10 bucks for each plane..

you could tell it was rushed together, like many MT games, just to get out there.

Heres my take.. I really hate MT games, I hope it goes away one day, even though I doubt it ever will, but any game that is heavily one sided for groups A or B, I don't go near it.

Mark my word, the next Xbox and PS3 will be mostly MT games, or at the very least require internet to play most games.

Silent Hunter online is no exception, I don't see a multiplayer aspect to it, at least not against each other, but I still wouldn't doubt that if you want better torpedoes, or say a type 7 Uboat, that you will have to BUY IT.

you will have to probably buy almost everything, engine upgrades, batteries and so on.

Its a sad thing these game companies are starting to do, but they are companies and they are in it to make money, they will keep it up until people smarten up..
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Old 03-06-13, 10:04 PM   #7
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The most ridiculous and can not be accepted=======In this game of course there are no human rivals
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Old 03-06-13, 11:13 PM   #8
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Quote:
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...but I still wouldn't doubt that if you want better torpedoes, or say a type 7 Uboat, that you will have to BUY IT.

you will have to probably buy almost everything, engine upgrades, batteries and so on.
Are you calling them liars? They already said you would not have to buy anything.

Of course if you want it now rather than next year sometime you can buy it.
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Old 03-08-13, 02:32 PM   #9
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Are you calling them liars? They already said you would not have to buy anything.

Of course if you want it now rather than next year sometime you can buy it.
You did watch that video right? The gameplay video.. The guy clearly shows and tells you that if you want certain "credits" you have to pay or EARN them

Which is exactly my point about the two types of players in these games.
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Old 03-08-13, 02:47 PM   #10
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And my point was that you said we'd probably have to pay for everything, and the reality is that we won't "have" to pay for anything. What they count on is people who will want to pay for extras. You don't have to pay for the TC points, you can wait for them to restore. You won't have to pay for engine upgrades; you can always wait until you've earned the points. Yes, you can EARN them, as you put it.

I agree with you about two kinds of players, and I agree with you about the choices. My comment was specifically directed at your earlier statement that we would probably "have" to buy almost everything.
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Old 03-08-13, 08:13 PM   #11
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Well.. They are not in it for people to "wait" for anything.. The entire engine will be designed to make you pull out your wallet.

How could you even play it without time compression ?? lol
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Old 03-08-13, 09:25 PM   #12
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How could you even play it without time compression ?? lol
Have you played it?
Time compression costs nothing, it is always available unless you do a mission with other players in a wolfpack, there you can't click the time compression button all players of a wolfpack must play in realtime.

In addition to the time compression you has some sort of jump points used on the strategic map, you can jump into the patrol area from your home base if you don't want to travel the distance in realtime or with time compression (like jumping into action in SH2)

These points are recharging during the patrol and you have enough free points to jump in and out of the patrol area with a Type II (a Type II have not much fuel to do more than one mission in a row) and enough free points to do more jumps with a Type VII or better. If you want to do endless jumps and don't want to wait for recharging (approx. 10 minutes while doing the mission) you can buy more points with credits earned by prior gameplay or by credits for real money.

Each player plays its own campaign, there is no cooperation in a global world like in other MMO's, you can decide if you are willing to pay for things or not. Paying gives you no advantage among other players because there are no other player in your campaign.
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Old 03-08-13, 09:58 PM   #13
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The entire engine will be designed to make you pull out your wallet.
That's true. "Need" to pay? To stay ahead, sure. "Want" to pay? That's the idea. It's a sucker's game.

But you specifically said "have" to pay. They said we won't. Either they're lying, or you're wrong.
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Old 03-08-13, 10:17 PM   #14
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Well.. I'm sorry.. didn't mean to make it like you have no other choice..

Let me rephrase the comment. You will more than likely WANT to pay money, or quit the game :0

I'm sticking with that!
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Old 03-10-13, 07:24 AM   #15
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... But then you're just stating the obvious.

The game was made. It cost money. Obviously they stuck it together to make you want to spend some money.

The difference in "free-to-play" games generally lies in having premium content that either gives a clear advantage or just saves time, though most games of course fall somewhere in between.


Imho if you ever feel forced to spend money on a F2P, stop playing. If you want to spend money, you're likely enjoying yourself and the developer probably deserves some compensation for their efforts.
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