US Politics Thread 2021-24

[Catfish]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

[...] I can see why some may be questioning our being in Ukraine.
[...]

^ You are not in Ukraine. But (including Europe's 'stand') isn't it convenient to let others fight the war.

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Catfish

^ You are not in Ukraine. But (including Europe's 'stand') isn't it convenient to let others fight the war.

I’m sure we have advisors in country. I didn’t like that wording either, I changed it

Sure it’s convenient. But still doesn’t answer what the hell our objective is.

[les green01]

Originally Posted by Catfish

^ You are not in Ukraine. But (including Europe's 'stand') isn't it convenient to let others fight the war.

someone been training them since 2014 and it hadn't just been cia they wasn't pull out until the invasion but i bet they are in there again including our specs ops but then most of europe dont pull their own weight if it wasn't for the old USA you guys be kissing putnuts feet except UK

[Catfish]

^ sure makes you proud to believe that, of course the US are doing a lot to help Ukraine now. Not that some in the US really want that, obviously.
For what I heard the sorry rest of the CIA got it's a$$ out of Ukraine in 2014 so fast no one heard the echo, they did a real Yanukovich.
Germany was sleeping and had the grand illusion that the time for wars were over, and had a rough awakening – some are not even awake here now.
But the great five eyes and their humongous system of spies and world power talk seem not to have seen this coming, just like the sleeping rest in Europe.

[les green01]

Originally Posted by Catfish

^ sure makes you proud to believe that, of course the US are doing a lot to help Ukraine now. Not that some in the US really want that, obviously.
For what I heard the sorry rest of the CIA got it's a$$ out of Ukraine in 2014 so fast no one heard the echo, they did a real Yanukovich.
Germany was sleeping and had the grand illusion that the time for wars were over, and had a rough awakening – some are not even awake here now.
But the great five eyes and their humongous system of spies and world power talk seem not to have seen this coming, just like the sleeping rest in Europe.

they wasnt pull out until the invasion or just before it of course you trump haters would say differnt like i say most of europe couldnt fight their way out of of a wet paper bag they get in a little bit of trouble they come running crying to the old USA

[Rockstar]

I don’t think the CIA left Ukraine. In fact Brennan visited Kiev a month after Russia annexed Crimea. Unfortunately those that know why ain’t tellin’. But some have said it was to assist Ukraine and share intel.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

But still doesn’t answer what the hell our objective is.

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/sho...postcount=5437


I think the source is not suspicious of being lefty.

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Skybird

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/sho...postcount=5437


I think the source is not suspicious of being lefty.

Obviously you missed my first reply

I don’t know about “the growing chorus”. For and against can be found on both sides of the isle and everywhere in between.

Though I disagree with the good Senator’s assessment of our support for Ukraine.. I can see why some may be questioning it. Namely because our current President has not even once stated what our goals are or what we are trying to achieve by throwing money and arms at Ukraine. What the hell is this administrations objective here? ‘With you until the end’, ‘Whatever it takes’ ‘we stand strong with Ukraine’ isn’t much of plan. Who’s prepared to take decisive action and say yes we are booting Russia out of Crimea and restoring Ukraine to its 1991 borders and securing our hegemony in the region. Biden needs to stop pussy footing’in around with empty slogans and drop the hammer.

I don’t care what you think the objective is, I don’t care what National Review thinks the objective is and I don’t care what any media talking head think the objective is. But then I do agree with General Hodges objectives and disagree with Senator Hawley but they are all nobodies. The only one that can define with any clarity what the objective is, is the guy at the top in elected office wielding the power of success and failure. He may not be king but he can rally. No leadership equals no unity and so far I have heard nothing but empty slogans and a thousand different opinions from talking heads who don’t matter.

[Skybird]

Biden is seriously underestimated, still. He is not one bit less "American interest first" than Republican conservatives. And he seems to understand the described links between supporting Ukraine and preparing against China. The aid he agreed to give is little compared to the US defence budget, and obviously is aimed at maximising losses and costs on Russia - not necessarily aimed at enabling Ukraine to "win". If the Ukraine'S victory were the objective: this could already have been achieved by now. Obviously, the fate of Ukraine and the price it has to pay for the American policy of not giving enough to win and too much to die, pays surprisingly little role in America's Ukraine policy. So far its about extending the war to weaken Russia further. That is the objective. Ukraine itself has surprisingly little to do with that.

-----

Germany should dismantle its Bundeswehr. Its not good for anythign. Hand over all Bundeswehr equipment - vehicles, weapons, ammo, EVERYTHING - to the Ukraine. we are surrounded by nations none of which we must fear wants to attack us any time soon. And we are not only unable but also unwilling to make any use of all that material stuff anyway, so... The Ukraine would deliver decisive blows to Russia with all that stuff. And Germany then could spend the next lets say 15 to 20 years with rebuilding its military from scratch, like after WW2. Making things better this way, and hopefull avoiding the mistakes of the last 30 years. What the BW is today is of use for nobody, and costs only money.

Okay, we'll keep the guard battalion that has to stand guard at diplomatic receptions - at least until it's relieved by the first uniformed operetta group of the feminist action front.

[Jimbuna]

The problem being....Germany probably wouldn't bother rebuilding her forces

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

The problem being....Germany probably wouldn't bother rebuilding her forces

No problem, our Greens and lefts want development aid to third world countries being counted as regular defence spendings. Serious. That way we can easily achieve a 3+ % defence budget without buying a single rifle.

[MaDef]

The aid he agreed to give is little compared to the US defence budget, and obviously is aimed at maximising losses and costs on Russia - not necessarily aimed at enabling Ukraine to "win".

If that is the case, then the U.S. bears some responsibility for ALL the death and Destruction in that region.

[August]

Originally Posted by MaDef

If that is the case, then the U.S. bears some responsibility for ALL the death and Destruction in that region.

The obvious third option is that they are doing all they are politically able to do.

After if that wasn't a concern and we really wanted them to win then we could just give the Ukrainians a few nuclear weapons.

[les green01]

that the thing people shooting their mouths off about US not wanting Ukraine to win but all their countries are sitting on the John Either take the lead or get off the pot,this is a europe problem not a US problem do i want Ukraine to win yep but at the same time i don't care either way,right now we have a moron with his head up his butt messing up the border and everything else

[MaDef]

The obvious third option is that they are doing all they are politically able to do.

you and I both know that's not true.