Crew detection distance for watch and sonar

CrashDive · 04-29-13, 11:37 PM

Hello all, I just got into SH4 and I am cruising the Formosa straight and noticed a reading on the sonar (green light). After following the merchant contact and closing I could clearly hear her screws at 7-8 nm but my sonar man can't detect anything.

I am now running parallel to her (surfaced) at a distance of 6nm while moving to get ahead into firing position. It is 6am, the weather is clear, no precip, no fog with a wind speed of 0 m/s. I can see her masts, exhaust/smoke and some of the deck using the binoculars. My deck watch crew does not detect her at all.

Clearly my guys are useless and I am a one man team.

My question is... what have people found to be the detection distance for the deck watch and sonar man under these conditions?

I can live with the sonar but the deck watch crew needs to shape up or I am going to throw them overboard. I can only imagine closing on a DD while in the control room and they don't notify me before the DD is already on an intercept course.

Using mods:
TMO 2.5
TMO 2.5 small patch
RSRDC for TMO 502
RSRDC v5 patch1

Redmane · 05-01-13, 09:30 PM

Wow, thats a toughie, someone more qualified than I should be able to help you resolve the issue. I play TMO as well, though I'm not yet playing the RSRD campaign, and have no problem with my watchmen spotting and notifing me of targets in visual range. Hope this little bump to your post gets it noticed

Capt. Morgan · 05-04-13, 11:17 AM

Tater's TMO visuals for RSRD might help, though Intended to solve a different problem, discussion here (link is in post 6).

I find I can usually see and hear better than my crew, but figured this was a crew experience issue. Crew will increase their skills with experience.

Also, the default crew selection when you get a new sub isn't usually the best - you can usually find crew working in the torpedo room who have much higher "watch" skills than some of the guys in the watch crew. Watch crew should have watch skills of 30 or better, Sonar should have very high "Electrical" skills and an officers rank.

Armistead · 05-04-13, 04:39 PM

Visual are determined by several factors.

The Data/Librarysensorvisualsub.sim values basically set your base visuals. These are adjusted by the Data.Cfg/Sensors.cfg which adjust the base values on fog, light, weather, etc..for better or worse. The next factor is crew ratings. Then your enviroment settings come into
play, you must adjust your sensors to work with your enviroment mod in function and a realistic enviromental look. Modders have to tweak and test all the above to work together realistically, which can take numerous
hours of testing.

I was working on increased visuals, basically got my crew to see to the horizon on a clear day, but the night range was still a tad too far. My crew could see ships at night up to 5 miles that I couldn't see in the dark. The goal is to find that balance the crew will see what I see.

As for sonar, the game basically restricts your crew to the equipment available, but it doesn't restrict you. Sonar itself will always hear ships to the furthest range of your best equipment, just your men only take advantage of what range the sonar equipment they have. As they get better sonar, you'll notice they start calling ranges further and further. Several other values effect sonar as well, being below the thermal, your speed, etc.

I think Trav was looking into increased visuals as well.

As I recall, the TMO visuals for RSRD mod effect how the AI sees you, not the other way around.

Sniper297 · 05-10-13, 10:58 PM

My theory is they totally screwed up the AI in this - the radar or sonar operators will report contacts WHICH CAN NOT BE SEEN. If the contact is visible to the deck watch or in the periscope, to the sensor operators it's no longer a "contact", so they know nothing about its existence. If you're in visual range of a target with the periscope up, the "not my job" syndrome affects the sound man - lower the periscope so the target is no longer visual THEN he becomes aware of it again. Raise the scope and he "loses" the contact again, because it has changed from a sound contact to a visual contact. Apparently the game is programmed so it can only be radar OR sonar OR visual, never more than one type at the same time.

CrashDive · 06-01-13, 11:21 AM

Thanks for the feedback guys!

I guess the one good thing that was added to my arsenal since posting this was the addition of surface radar, which helps offset the problems with sonar and watch detection.

04-29-13, 11:37 PM	#1
CrashDive Swabbie Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 12 Downloads: 14 Uploads: 0	Crew detection distance for watch and sonar Hello all, I just got into SH4 and I am cruising the Formosa straight and noticed a reading on the sonar (green light). After following the merchant contact and closing I could clearly hear her screws at 7-8 nm but my sonar man can't detect anything. I am now running parallel to her (surfaced) at a distance of 6nm while moving to get ahead into firing position. It is 6am, the weather is clear, no precip, no fog with a wind speed of 0 m/s. I can see her masts, exhaust/smoke and some of the deck using the binoculars. My deck watch crew does not detect her at all. Clearly my guys are useless and I am a one man team. My question is... what have people found to be the detection distance for the deck watch and sonar man under these conditions? I can live with the sonar but the deck watch crew needs to shape up or I am going to throw them overboard. I can only imagine closing on a DD while in the control room and they don't notify me before the DD is already on an intercept course. Using mods: TMO 2.5 TMO 2.5 small patch RSRDC for TMO 502 RSRDC v5 patch1

05-01-13, 09:30 PM	#2
Redmane Torpedoman Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Somewhere in the Pacific Posts: 113 Downloads: 20 Uploads: 0	Wow, thats a toughie, someone more qualified than I should be able to help you resolve the issue. I play TMO as well, though I'm not yet playing the RSRD campaign, and have no problem with my watchmen spotting and notifing me of targets in visual range. Hope this little bump to your post gets it noticed __________________ REDMANE Beneath this mask there is more than flesh. Beneath this mask there is an idea, Mr. Creedy, and ideas are bullet-proof. -V

05-04-13, 11:17 AM	#3
Capt. Morgan Commander Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Just east of the west coast. Posts: 462 Downloads: 404 Uploads: 0	Tater's TMO visuals for RSRD might help, though Intended to solve a different problem, discussion here (link is in post 6). I find I can usually see and hear better than my crew, but figured this was a crew experience issue. Crew will increase their skills with experience. Also, the default crew selection when you get a new sub isn't usually the best - you can usually find crew working in the torpedo room who have much higher "watch" skills than some of the guys in the watch crew. Watch crew should have watch skills of 30 or better, Sonar should have very high "Electrical" skills and an officers rank. __________________ There are no great men, only great challenges that ordinary men are forced by circumstances to meet. -- Admiral William Halsey

05-04-13, 04:39 PM	#4
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,864 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Visual are determined by several factors. The Data/Librarysensorvisualsub.sim values basically set your base visuals. These are adjusted by the Data.Cfg/Sensors.cfg which adjust the base values on fog, light, weather, etc..for better or worse. The next factor is crew ratings. Then your enviroment settings come into play, you must adjust your sensors to work with your enviroment mod in function and a realistic enviromental look. Modders have to tweak and test all the above to work together realistically, which can take numerous hours of testing. I was working on increased visuals, basically got my crew to see to the horizon on a clear day, but the night range was still a tad too far. My crew could see ships at night up to 5 miles that I couldn't see in the dark. The goal is to find that balance the crew will see what I see. As for sonar, the game basically restricts your crew to the equipment available, but it doesn't restrict you. Sonar itself will always hear ships to the furthest range of your best equipment, just your men only take advantage of what range the sonar equipment they have. As they get better sonar, you'll notice they start calling ranges further and further. Several other values effect sonar as well, being below the thermal, your speed, etc. I think Trav was looking into increased visuals as well. As I recall, the TMO visuals for RSRD mod effect how the AI sees you, not the other way around. __________________ You see my dog don't like people laughing. He gets the crazy idea you're laughing at him. Now if you apologize like I know you're going to, I might convince him that you really didn't mean it.

05-10-13, 10:58 PM	#5
Sniper297 The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Philadelphia Shipyard Brig Posts: 1,386 Downloads: 160 Uploads: 19	My theory is they totally screwed up the AI in this - the radar or sonar operators will report contacts WHICH CAN NOT BE SEEN. If the contact is visible to the deck watch or in the periscope, to the sensor operators it's no longer a "contact", so they know nothing about its existence. If you're in visual range of a target with the periscope up, the "not my job" syndrome affects the sound man - lower the periscope so the target is no longer visual THEN he becomes aware of it again. Raise the scope and he "loses" the contact again, because it has changed from a sound contact to a visual contact. Apparently the game is programmed so it can only be radar OR sonar OR visual, never more than one type at the same time.

06-01-13, 11:21 AM	#6
CrashDive Swabbie Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 12 Downloads: 14 Uploads: 0	Thanks for the feedback guys! I guess the one good thing that was added to my arsenal since posting this was the addition of surface radar, which helps offset the problems with sonar and watch detection.