What video card should I buy with £100?

[Wreford-Brown]

I almost hijacked a thread by Zachstar on ATI graphics cards but now need some more in depth advice. I also need to thank Zachstar, CaptainHaplo and CCIP for the help they've already given. My system:
MS Windows XP SP3
Pentium 4 3.06 GHz
3.0 GB RAM
NVIDIA GeForce 6200 LE

It's the graphics card that's causing me headaches as it's giving me 5 to 7 FPS on SH4 and I reckon Santa may be able to bring me a new one.

I'm in the UK and reckon that shipping and customs will prevent me buying from the North American market. I've only been onto PC World and overclockers.co.uk websites so far and have found the following in budget:

PNY GeForce 8800 GT 512MB PCI-E Graphics Card
BFG GeForce 8800 GTS OC 512MB PCIe 2.0 Graphics Card
XFX 9600 GT OC 512MB PCI-E Graphics Card
PNY GeForce 9600GT 512MB PCI-E Graphics Card
PNY GeForce 9600GT XLR8 OC 512MB PCI-E Graphics Card
PNY GeForce 9500GT 512MB PCI-E Graphics Card
Powercolor ATI Radeon HD 4830 512MB GDDR3 TV-Out/Dual DVI/HDMI
Nvidia Geforce 9800GT 512MB PCI-E

The questions are:
Is a higher number a better card?
What is the difference between a regular card and an overclocked one?
Does the brand make a difference (PNY vs XFX etc.)?
Are there any better websites I can browse?
Is there a simple comparison site for graphics cards?
How do I work out what my power supply is and will it make a big difference?

[Zachstar]

It depends wildly.

For ATI you got the advantage of a company with lower prices because they are trying to catch back up.

For Nvidia you know you are getting the best of the best but not always for the cheap.

So unless you are ready to spend 300 USD I suggest going ATI.

The ATI card you listed looks REALLY modern (HDMI on card) Do be aware tho that it's HDMI audio may be only optical rerouted and not the dedicated copy protected path that gives you full features of a dedicated Blu Ray player (This only applies if you intend to watch blu ray tho)

BTW to get a sense of what the numbers mean I suggest looking at the wiki articles.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATI_Radeon

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeForce

For power supply the thing to look for is watts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watt

[Wreford-Brown]

I'm struggling to find the wattage of my system. Is there any way to dig the info out of the OS? I've physically looked on the outside of the tower but haven't yet taken the panels off.

[CCIP]

Originally Posted by Wreford-Brown

I'm struggling to find the wattage of my system. Is there any way to dig the info out of the OS? I've physically looked on the outside of the tower but haven't yet taken the panels off.

It should be on your power supply, it's generally a big box located at the top and back of the system. You should be able to see it on the side if you look inside the system. Generally speaking, unless you bought a budget PC that saves on those things, you should have enough. Unless you have multiple HDs or other power-sucking devices, 450-500 watt (which is normal for most mid-range PCs) will be plenty enough for a new card. I wouldn't worry over it too much unless you have reason to believe that the PC's maker would've thrown a cheap, bad power supply on you.

As far as numbering, it's been a long time since I followed ATI's system, but with nVidia, higher number isn't neccesarily better.

Basically, you have a 4-digit number, of which the two first numbers are most important. The first number is more or less a 'generation'; the second number we can call 'series'. Generally speaking, any card that has #8## (2nd number an 8, e.g. 8800) is of the high-performance series for its' given generation; #6## is the mid-range card that has a good cost-for-performance ratio; and anything less than that is generally cheap budget cards which should be avoided for gaming purposes. A 9800 will most likely be a bit better than an 8800, but that difference may be less in terms of raw speed and more in terms of features on the card. An 8800 may actually be a bit faster than a 9600 (depending on make). Even an 8600 is certainly better than a 9200.

Overclocking - a video card, like the processor, can be overclocked to run faster, at the cost of greater power consumption, more heat being produced, and possibly increased instability. You can always overclock a video card yourself, if you are sure that you can keep it cool enough.
Some companies, such as BFG, ship their cards pre-overclocked - which is generally a good thing because they ship with added cooling that makes the card stable and cool even when overclocked. Generally the performance gain in pre-overclocked cards is not huge, but if the price difference between a non-overclocked and an overclocked card is none or small - the overclocked card may also be worth it. BFG's cards are generally pre-overclocked, but also come with lifetime warranty and have a very good reputation, so as long as an overclocked card is properly cooled it's not a liability in any way.

Which brings me to the next question - a brand does make a difference, but I would look more at features that come with the card than the brand itself. Generally a good video card manufacturer provides solid cooling and good warranty on the card at least. I'm not exactly rich so I couldn't exactly go around trying out all sorts of brands. I can vouch for BFG and XFX both being very reputable manufacturers with solid products. Had more than one card by both and zero problems. Their cards are well-optimized and have very good cooling. For others - I suggest you check reviews.

A good place to start if you're looking for reviews and comparisons would be here: http://www.tomshardware.com/

Also, a hundred pounds is not a bad video card budget! Personally, what I'd be looking at with that sort of money is probably an 8800 card. Prices on them have come down by a lot, yet they're still true performance cards that live up to today's standards very well.

[Wreford-Brown]

CCIP - thank you. I've reduced the cards I'm looking at to the ATI card and the three '8' series Nvidia cards.

I'll check the power supply this evening (last time I took the tower apart my wife accused me of breaking the computer!).

The 8800s are looking good but the 9800 was on special offer, reduced from £140. I'm still a believer in paying more for better and as they are all in budget I may go for the 9800. That website has a wealth of knowledge.

[CCIP]

Sure, if you can - go for it! The 9800 will be more future-proof, in any case.

It's a shame I don't have a desktop PC anymore. This is a good time to upgrade, especially when it comes to video cards. I bought an 8600GT a year ago for the exact same price as the 9800 you're looking at right now - and I thought that was pretty cheap. You'd be getting a very good deal, no doubt.

Good if an ATI expert could pitch in here though. I got nothing against them, but I have no experience with them recently (the last ATI cards I had my hands on were an ATI Rage 128 and a Radeon 9600, which are looooong obsolete).

[edit]

For the sake of mentioning something on it - one thing that kept me away from ATI cards is their driver support. They're great cards for sure, but the software support leaves things to be desired. Their drivers aren't updated as often as nVidia's, don't seem to be as good in terms of features, and often come with problems to begin with. Unfortunately that's something that often happens with hardware - great product, shoddy driver support. Out of things I own, things like Saitek's HOTAS controllers and Creative X-Fi sound cards come to mind. The item itself is good, software not so great and often requires a lot of messing around to get working as you want it to.

[Wreford-Brown]

I've got Nvidia on my desktop and ATI on my laptop. Between the two, I prefer the Nvidia so I may go with what I know.

[CaptainHaplo]

Driver support for ATI has gotten better over the last 6-12 months. I recall when the "Detonator" series of drivers for NVidia were the headaches and ATI drivers were the bomb. Its a cycle and right now both companies are doing well at driver support.

If you were in the US I would say check Newegg - they have some sweet EVGA boards (Like a 9600GT 512 for $85). You asked about manufacturer - yes it matters - but only to a point. The real issue is the quality - the boards are equal speed wise most of the time - its an issue of parts quality and long term life.

[Wreford-Brown]

Another one has come onto my radar:

Nvidia® Geforce 9800GT 1GB PCI-E Graphics Card
<LI class=moduleBulletText>Full Microsoft DirectX 10 Shader Model 4.0 support <LI class=moduleBulletText>Play the latest DX10 games and watch high definition movies on your PC <LI class=moduleBulletText>Features NVIDIA PhysX™ technology <LI class=moduleBulletText>1GB GDDR graphics memory <LI class=moduleBulletText>112 stream processors <LI class=moduleBulletText>256 bit memory bus <LI class=moduleBulletText>Built for Microsoft® Windows Vista
The question I have is - will it run with my Win XP SP3?

[longam]

With a Pentium 4 3.06 GHz I double check your video card slot to make sure its not AGP.

[Wreford-Brown]

Double checked - System info lists my current video card in PCI bus 1 and CCIP put a very useful photo in this thread:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=143907

[CaptainHaplo]

yes the 9800 GT will work with XP
Here is a link to the driver - read the release notes. The previous rev added support for the 98xx series among other things.

http://www.nvidia.com/object/winxp_178.24_whql.html

[Wreford-Brown]

I currently have a PSIe port but may be looking to upgrade in the next 12 months or so.

The 9800GT is a PSIe 2.0 card. I'm happy to accept reduced performance from the graphics card in order to give me the ability to upgrade in the future, but will a PSIe 2.0 card work in a PSIe port?

[CaptainHaplo]

Yes PCIe 2.0 is backwards compatible with the older x16 port. And as I posted to Zackstar - another 9800 GT will be very cheap later if you build a box and go SLI! Great graphics and speed for chump change!

[Wreford-Brown]

Finally got clearance from the boss to invest in the new card.
The choices are:
Nvidia Geforce 9800GT 512MB PCI-E Graphics Card
or
Nvidia Geforce 9500GT 1GB PCI-E Graphics Card

The 9500 has greater memory but is an older version than 9800. Any advice?