US Politics Thread 2021-24

[Gorpet]

If you have any ball's where are you from?

[Arlo]

Originally Posted by Gorpet

If you have any ball's where are you from?

Oh, Jeebus, you're still at it. I'm from Texas. What zoo are you from?

[Gorpet]

Originally Posted by Arlo

To complete the picture ... you apparently think you see 'left wing extremism' where I don't and you apparently see threats to democracy where I don't. (Feel free to protest that you didn't post nor do you feel such. *ShruG*)

Let me illustrate.

If we were to agree that fascism is a form of extremism (per your insistence, I really don't know if you think so or not but I do) then what does that make anti-fascism per definition? Is it extremism on the other end or is it anti-extremism (bearing in mind that it's not an organized group, per say and that its only 'agenda' is to fight fascism)? Also bear in mind that there have been no individuals who espouse anti-fascism that have tried to overthrow the U.S. government, in whole or in part, nor is there any evidence of any anti-fascist individuals or groupings advocating doing so. There are no anti-fascist individuals or groupings arming themselves and standing at voting locations attempting to intimidate non-anti-fascists out of voting.

I am against extremism of all flavors - Muslim, Christian, Jewish, fascists, nazis, militants in general (homegrown unregulated militias qualify), white supremacists and so forth and so on. U.S. politics does not have an extreme left. There is definitely an extreme right, however, that seems to view everything to the left of it (no matter how slight) as extreme. Their fear/hatred of anti-fascism and the Black Lives Matter movement is merely an attempt at 'what-about-ism.'

Fair enough?

Look's to me that we have a professor with tenure.

[Arlo]

Originally Posted by Gorpet

Look's to me that we have a professor with tenure.

If you keep complimenting me I might have to just keep taking them.

[Onkel Neal]

Let's keep the conversation civil, please.

[u crank]

Originally Posted by Arlo

To complete the picture ... you apparently think you see 'left wing extremism' where I don't and you apparently see threats to democracy where I don't.

It is obvious we have a different view on this subject. I'm not convinced and so far nothing you have said has changed my mind.

If we were to agree that fascism is a form of extremism (per your insistence, I really don't know if you think so or not but I do) then what does that make anti-fascism per definition?

Well we agree on something. I think fascism is a form of extremism. The problem is how to address this threat. In America, in my country Canada and other nations groups of people dress in black (it use to be brown) go into the street to apparently fight fascism. To do this they engage in violent acts, destroy property, threaten innocent bystanders, attack members of the media, fight with the police and seek out and violently attack their political opponents. This is textbook fascism. Let's ask the relevant question. Do you support this kind of behavior? Do you cheer it on? Do you engage in it?

I guess I am an old school type of guy. I think that any kind of political violence is wrong and a threat to the civilized democratic order. I don't care what the cause is. I condemn all of it, right, left and center. The Antifa movement, violent segments of BLM and other fringe groups on the left engage in this kind of illegal and violent behavior. Do you condemn it?

U.S. politics does not have an extreme left. There is definitely an extreme right, however, ....

I guess it is hard to condemn something if you don't think it exists. I understand your position perfectly. So be it.

[MaDef]

U.S. politics does not have an extreme left

.
Bernie Sanders
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
Kamala Harris
Ilhan Omar

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Arlo

Sadly, I'm sure you believe that.

No I do not believe anything anymore

I based my comments on what I have seen in the news throughout the years-When there's a demonstration in some cities in our western world and this demonstration evolve from peaceful to violent I always hear in the news that it was the far left/antifa.

If this should wrong then please enlighten me..I'm here to learn.

Markus

[Arlo]

Originally Posted by u crank

It is obvious we have a different view on this subject. I'm not convinced and so far nothing you have said has changed my mind.

Didn't expect it would. Exchanging opinions seldom pulls someone across the divide they prefer, nowadays.

Originally Posted by u crank

Well we agree on something. I think fascism is a form of extremism. The problem is how to address this threat. In America, in my country Canada and other nations groups of people dress in black (it use to be brown) go into the street to apparently fight fascism. To do this they engage in violent acts, destroy property, threaten innocent bystanders, attack members of the media, fight with the police and seek out and violently attack their political opponents. This is textbook fascism. Let's ask the relevant question. Do you support this kind of behavior? Do you cheer it on? Do you engage in it?

I don't confuse Antifa for brownshirts of the 1920s. You're projecting the traits of the 'Proud/Boogaloo Boys onto them. They've been caught, more than once, attempting to infiltrate Antifa, dressed in black and destroying property, in order to discredit them. They obviously weren't very good at it and Anti-fascists tried to stop them (at least busting their cover). I certainly don't support Proud/Boogaloo Boys behavior. They want disruption and violence in the street and many of them want a racial civil war.

Originally Posted by u crank

I guess I am an old school type of guy. I think that any kind of political violence is wrong and a threat to the civilized democratic order. I don't care what the cause is. I condemn all of it, right, left and center. The Antifa movement, violent segments of BLM and other fringe groups on the left engage in this kind of illegal and violent behavior. Do you condemn it?

When and if it really happens, I would.

Take care.

[Arlo]

Originally Posted by MaDef

.
Bernie Sanders
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
Kamala Harris
Ilhan Omar

My statement stands. False equivalency ain't my thing.

[Arlo]

Originally Posted by mapuc

No I do not believe anything anymore

I based my comments on what I have seen in the news throughout the years-When there's a demonstration in some cities in our western world and this demonstration evolve from peaceful to violent I always hear in the news that it was the far left/antifa.

If this should wrong then please enlighten me..I'm here to learn.

Markus

Trying my best. Biased source preference will never give you a true picture. You need to be less vociferous over the sensationalized right leaning articles and learn to separate the wheat from the chaff. Alas, Russian propaganda seems to be the favorite flavor, for some.

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Arlo

Trying my best. Biased source preference will never give you a true picture. You need to be less vociferous over the sensationalized right leaning articles and learn to separate the wheat from the chaff. Alas, Russian propaganda seems to be the favorite flavor, for some.

Thank you Arlo.

Reading your answer, makes me wonder-who are they, those who only take part in a demonstration to destroy things and fight the police.

Maybe they are non-political ? Don't have any political standpoint they just like to destroy a peaceful demonstration.

Markus

[Arlo]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Thank you Arlo.

Reading your answer, makes me wonder-who are they, those who only take part in a demonstration to destroy things and fight the police.

Maybe they are non-political ? Don't have any political standpoint they just like to destroy a peaceful demonstration.

Markus

I've mentioned the Proud Boys and the Boogaloo Boys. Those are two of the worst groups.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/who-are...ys-11601485755

https://ctc.usma.edu/pride-prejudice...he-proud-boys/

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...nt/3204899001/

https://www.theatlantic.com/technolo...vement/613843/

[mapuc]

^ All of these link you posted are related to USA and the name you wrote are active in USA.

But I was thinking Europe-France, UK, Germany a.s.o.

Many years ago there was some huge demonstration in England and it developed from peaceful to a destructive demonstration.

Proud Boys are what I know far right.

Could it be different between who's destructive in USA and Europe ?

Markus

[Arlo]

Originally Posted by mapuc

^ All of these link you posted are related to USA and the name you wrote are active in USA.

But I was thinking Europe-France, UK, Germany a.s.o.

Many years ago there was some huge demonstration in England and it developed from peaceful to a destructive demonstration.

Proud Boys are what I know far right.

Could it be different between who's destructive in USA and Europe ?

Markus

Doubtful. Far right extremists are dangerous globally.