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[Raptor1]

Originally Posted by roman2440

Arrg - that friendly fire sucks - first night the carnage can begin and I get torpedoed by my own side

The only suggestion I would make is that when the initial class assignments are doled out, make sure that even the bad guys have some sort of background info. Mine was just simply that I was part of the rescue team and that I had heard the call of the kraken, I had no information as to my role as part of the rescue team which made it hard to figure out how to role-play anything other than a monster (which if he is to remain free of lynching most definately should not be role-played in front of anyone who is going to live).

You make up your own role based on the information you have, all of us that had them did

I think part of the reason you got fragged was lack of posting...

[Nisgeis]

Originally Posted by Raptor1

Yeah, but the humans were sure you was human, or at least those following Undersea...

Lol, no one was sure. But fine, have it your way, the game was hopelessly rigged and there was no way the humans could have won. I had it easy, whatever.

[Raptor1]

Never said that, but the majority of people were convinced you were human directly or indirectly

Ah, well, it's been fun anyway

[Nisgeis]

Originally Posted by Raptor1

Never said that, but the majority of people were convinced you were human directly or indirectly

That is incorrect, a small minority of people strongly thought I had been a human, but knew that I may no longer be and could be a monster. I was worried at the time that I would get this kind of criticism if I by some miracle won (easily?). So, I told Undersea that there was a new spirit and later on I told TarJak, to put the screws on Undersea. Hardly anyone was told I was human, you'll have to ask Undersea to be sure, but the assertion that everyone knew I was human, so that's how I won is wrong. Whatever perspective you take, I did not keep the new spirit a secret and did not exclude myself from being a monster. I won by keeping the higher priority suspicion on other people. I think more people were told I was a suspect than thought I was human.

You all just insisisted on not voting. At the point when Raptor was lynched, only three people voted, out of ten!!! If I had of been an independent monster from the start, this would have been a great way to get people lynched as one vote had massive sway, as everyone was abstain mad. This of course was because of the atmosphere that was the same as the last game, ie a revenge vote culture, where one person is afraid to vote for another, in case their card is marked even if that's the only evidence against them. If anyone discusses anything to do with someone else being a monster, then that person accuses them back of being a monster, so it's no wonder you could all be manipulated into, as Jimbuna put it, being sheep, as it was nice and safe and as long as no one was voting for them, they were happy with it. No one dared talking about things that made people look suspicious, as they all wanted to keep safe, so in a nutshell the humans acted alone, even though they outnumbered the werefish by about nine to one. There were even talks about not lynching people - weird! That would effectively give two night cycles in a row to the monsters. Jimbuna was correct. Conversely the monsters should always attack, as otherwise it's giving the humans two day cycles in a row. A few, like Oberon and Tarrasque dared to vote against someone else and start up some accusations, but this was rare.

Jimbuna almost ruined my careful plan, by trying to get people to vote, as that would affect the very small voting power I could influence - it was much better for me if no one else voted and that's true of any situation where there is a monster, if you don't vote, then the monster gets a more influential vote. Other people were much more suspicious than I was, due to what they were doing and saying. I was quite careful.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Nisgeis

Lol, no one was sure. But fine, have it your way, the game was hopelessly rigged and there was no way the humans could have won. I had it easy, whatever.

Now now, keep them claws in, the guy is just giving his input.

I think a couple of minor changes I'd like to see would be an end to infinite abstentions....second abstention or failure to vote and your out of the game....the game could go on forever otherwise.

Perhaps even voting via PM and all are posted together at the allotted time.....might put an end to some of the bullying tactics and sheep herding (in a gaming context).

After all, the idea of the game is to lynch the monsters before the humans are all killed, a war of attrition if you like.

Be advised, the above points are meant to be constructive suggestions and certainly not as criticism at Letum, he ran the game his way and a fine job he did.......for a Yorkshire pudding/yokel

Edit: Looks like we have cross posted.

Being the fact that I was the "Spirit of Cthulu" I will post what happened Out-Of-Character. Then I will post that journal my character has been writing, role played of course.

On the first day, I was talking to SandyCaesar alot in real life and posting Letum alot (All game as well) on what I can and cannot do. I then tried to role-play as a frightened new sailor in a nightmare who would be willing to do anything for anyone. Most of the time that I was on here I never thought about being the "Cthulu", so most of those gathering info things I did to you Undersea, I would have done that even if I was human, weird huh. I decided on killing off those who posted the least as to avoid any suspicion early game so I killed the Vice Admiral first night. The next night my target was Roman2440, because he only posted once. Unfortunatly, he was the other monster, but on the plus side, I got a guardian as well. The next 2 nights i didn't attack for 3 reasons. 1, Baggygreen was in the brig and I was hoping to put suspicion on him. 2, I was afriad of killing more monsters and was seeing if there were any left. And the 3rd and most important reason was... I was offline for both night periods. At that point I knew my end was coming and I wanted to have as much fun as possible, but then Nisgeis said he joined the monster's side. I knew that we had no hope of Killing Undersea without suspicion from the rest of the invetigation so I was planning on the locker thing as a fun way of my death. I got the idea from "Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic" where that one guy was locked in a locker and babbling about fishies. I was going to do this as a way to attract as much attention to myself and give credibility to Nisgeis and push him a ways forward. Then came to 2 great mobs, mine vs Undersea's that resulted in a tie. Just a few hours before the results I posted this to Letum and we had this conversation.

Originally Posted by Silverraptor

Like I said before, if the votes tally up against me when the lights go out, have the lynch mob corner me and me transform right in front of them. Describe a fight scene, then result in my death and the mob still alive. I want my death to be spectacular!

Originally Posted by Letum

You got lucky!
Mookie didn't vote for the 3rd time so I had someone I needed to get rid off.

You are dead, bad luck, but you take mookie with you.

Please don't say anything that will effect the rest of the game in the
discussion thread at all. Including discussing past events in detail.

I wanted my death to be epic since I was THE Spirit of Cthulu and the sub was roughly a third the size of my ego. And that's what I did, please stand by for the journal life of Silverraptor, OS.

[Nisgeis]

Originally Posted by jimbuna

Now now, keep them claws in, the guy is just giving his input.

OK, fair enough, I think I was just p'd off that the first post was:

If only we'd had one more daylight period - Nisgeis would be dead.

Like, as if somehow the game had been fixed and I only won because it finished too early, when of course I had given my attack instructions and I had attacked and killed Tarrasque in the night, so he wouldn't have been alive to lynch anyone.

Then people started saying I had an advantage and everyone knew I was human, which was not true. It was just all a bit too much together and sounded a bit sour grapes to me. It doesn't make me want to, if given the choice again, to extend the game.

Originally Posted by jimbuna

I think a couple of minor changes I'd like to see would be an end to infinite abstentions....second abstention or failure to vote and your out of the game....the game could go on forever otherwise.

The original rule in the join up post was you can abstain three times, I'm not sure why it changed. I *think* (from my side anyway) that the no change rule made some people abstain early, in case they couldn't get back on later.

Originally Posted by jimbuna

Perhaps even voting via PM and all are posted together at the allotted time.....might put an end to some of the bullying tactics and sheep herding (in a gaming context).

Good idea, but may swamp the poor old GM.

Originally Posted by jimbuna

After all, the idea of the game is to lynch the monsters before the humans are all killed, a war of attrition if you like.

It is exactly that.

[Tarrasque]

OK, fair enough, I think I was just p'd off that the first post was:


Quote:
If only we'd had one more daylight period - Nisgeis would be dead.
Like, as if somehow the game had been fixed and I only won because it finished too early,

That certainly wasn't my intention - you won it fair and square, no debate about it. It was just so close....

[TarJak]

Good game and well played Nigeis.

I think the game could be improved upon by holding to a 1 or 2 abstention limit forcing more people to vote. The lack of voting surprised me as well and was probably the most disappointing aspect of the game for me.

[Letum]

I don't intend to dig trenches round the way I did this or that, but here are
my thoughts on a few points:

Originally Posted by Nisgeis

well I for one would like to see 'official game actions' put in my the game master, then we won't have any of this second guessing is that a 'real book' or a 'fake book'. That's been a problem in both games, as people make up so much stuff, that the genuine game thread gets lost among the blizard of player created content.

The problem there is that I did not want to discourage lies and deceit.

Originally Posted by Raptor1

Yeah, but the humans were sure you [Nisgeis] was human, or at least those following Undersea...

If they where sure, they got their assurance from an assumption.

Originally Posted by roman2440

The only suggestion I would make is that when the initial class assignments are doled out, make sure that even the bad guys have some sort of background info.

No players got any kind of indepth background info. 50% of players (inc.
fish) got a little tip-bit of info randomly.

I'd like to see would be an end to infinite abstentions

That surprised me about this game.
I didn't think an abstention limit would be important as the game works in
such a way that it is to the advantage of all classes that they vote.
Random, heard voting is, in fact, quite a good survivor tactic.

Perhaps even voting via PM and all are posted together at the allotted time.....might put an end to some of the bullying tactics and sheep herding (in a gaming context).

hehe...and fill up my PM box another 10 times?
It still might be a good idea for the next game. A blind vote is another idea.

The original rule in the join up post was you can abstain three times

Not the case. No rules where changed in that thread apart from the
addition of the leader/brig rules.

[UnderseaLcpl]

By popular request, here is my story and that of the investigation, which I shall attempt to keep mercifully brief. Some of you are familiar with the last KGB-style investigative effort, which failed. There were some important differences in this one, but it failed as well. Nonetheless, it was a lot of fun. Threatening people can be very entertaining

Obviously, the basic tenet is to force compliance and control the vote when neccessary. Properly executed, this ensures the survival of core investigation members. The death of Chad early on due to not voting (we would have won the vote, despite Nisgeis' underhanded efforts, if he had voted) was an unexpected development, but not a failure of the process.

The next step is to gain credibility and expand influence. This is accomplished by a variety of means. Some of you recieved harsh threats for noncompliance. Obviously, the vast majority of you never recieved the death penalty for witholding information. Most bad lynchings were the result of activities outside the investigation, and in one case (Oberon), my unavailability. Only JALU3 was lynched for witholding information and that was because he was particularly obstinate, and we needed an example to be set. He was chosen simply because we didn't have any good suspects at the time.
We also sought to simultaneously expand our influence and catch a monster (further expanding it) by using a complicated system of "baited" communications and informers. In its' most basic form, this consists of convincing a person to send a certain PM to a few other people, at least one of which is a member of the investigation. Then we sit back and see if they send the proper message, and double-check the investigation members they send it to by seeing if they report it like they are supposed to. Of all the people I talked to, Nokia and SandyCaesar were the only ones to be exonerated by this process. Nokia was only lynched because of the impossibly small chance that Nisgeis was both a seer and a monster.
If you are reading this Nokia, you were probably somewhat confused by the PM I sent you, followed by a lynch vote. It was intended to make sure that your next target would be Tarrasque or no one at all. Despite the fact that you passed all the communications checks and were truthful in your last interrogation, it was still less probable that Nisgeis was the monster. I was so convinced of his veracity that you were lynched simply for being unconfirmed. A total failure on my part, I admit.
On the other hand, the system worked marvelously well against Silverraptor. He began by giving incomplete information immediately, and trying to claim that he was a guardian. If that doesn't scream "infiltrator" I don't know what does. He insisted on leaving out the two bait PMs until he thought he was in a lot of trouble. By the time he reported them, it was too late for him. The investigation had locked on and accquired its' first target. Even worse, he ceased his attacks. That says; "I'm scared and I am doing whatever I can to buy more time"
However, since we had a bonafide seer, and he had been intimidated (probably) into not attacking, there was no point in lynching him unless we were absolutely sure. The initial lynch vote against him was a fluke, called at the last minute because Chad was being threatened. As the most likely (and as it turns out, only monster at that point) he was the best choice. In the end, Chad's failure to vote sealed his fate, both by game rules and by popular choice.

Imo, this was the point at which the balance shifted. Nisgeis seered SR just to be sure, and told me he was a monster, which I was pretty sure of already. As it turned out, that act made Nisgeis a monster(sort of, he had a choice), an eventuality I was totally unprepared for. If Nisgeis had said SR was a human, I would have had SR lynched anyway to test Nisgeis. Nisgeis was generous enough to provide plenty of correlating evidence that he was misleading us already, so I think I could have had him killed post-mortem. My plan was to suicide after I had informed Tarjak and a couple others I investigated long before the vote was clear, thus establishing my credibility and pinning a monster.
Against all odds, Nisgeis reported SR as a monster, and it was all over for SR. Even more, he reported that an additional evil presence was on the boat, a truly brilliant move that took almost all attention off of him. Almost.
I initiated a plan to brig people insted of killing them. The intent was to get Tarjak installed as leader at some point, or keep Jim, if he was human, and then have them release all of the brig captives except for Baggygreen if it looked like Nisgeis was the monster. If Nisgeis was not the monster, myself and whomever else was totally trustworthy would instalynch the brig captives and escape. It probably would have worked, if some people hadn't been so determined to kill themselves and other people they were not supposed to.

In the end, it was me who goofed up everything for the humans. I was so convinced that Nisgeis could not have been a monster (thanks to his machinations), that I let Nokia die and even voted to elect Nisgeis as leader. At that point, I was trying to buy time with a plan that totally failed, believing that Nisgeis could be challenged in a lynch vote on the last day if I could convince him not to kill that night.

To those of you who think that Nisgeis had an easy time of this affair, I will tell you that he did not. He passed check after check until it was too late for us. He may have been aided by the fact that he was a seer/monster, but he defeated all countermeasures arrayed against him.
And those were good countermeasures. Multiple covert PM checks, testimony analysis, and other measures were taken, none of which produced even a hint that he was lying.

So there you have it.The story of the Investigation, or at least as much as I care to tell. Transcripts of interrogations and conversations are available upon request.

[Nokia]

I must admit I was quite suprised to be voted of by the investigation. After Silverraptor got lynched the only way for me to get killed was to get lynched and thus the investigation was a bit of a threat and that's why I saw it best to cooperate as much as possible with them. I suspected that someone in the investigation could be the monster but I didn't wan't to risk me getting lynched because I claimed it was someone on the inside. But I never ever suspected the monster was Nisgeis so superbly played mate you deserved to win !
The biggest mistakes where probably voting for Oberon and me miscalculating the votes when I voted for Jimbuna . I counted the votes and thought that there was no way to make any differance and therefor I voted the same as the investigation not to risk me getting lynched. Only afterwards I recounted the votes and saw that there could have been a tie (between TarJak(?) and Jimbuna). But all in all the game was a blast so thanks to Letum and once more congratulations to Nisgeis

[Jimbuna]

Oh, one more small suggestion before I forget.....a maximum of one in the brig at any given time

[Letum]

Why?

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Letum

Why?

It would stop the inquisition herding all the sheep into a confined space.

It would also help in breaking the siege-like mentality that pervades often quite quickly.

It would prevent people being taken out of the game by means other than being lynched (I'm thinking of the two who were incarcerated for most of the last game) and enable them to play a full and active part like all the other perticipants.

Most importantly, it would help ensure people embraced the ethos of the game....'kill or be killed'....'get them before they get you'.