Here we go again-Ukraine once again

[Jimbuna]

Putin's chilling threat of Satan-II nuclear missile attack after Zelensky's visit to US

Vladimir Putin said on Wednesday that chances of peace talks with Ukraine had been slashed by Volodymyr Zelensky's decision to visit US President Joe Biden. Speaking at a meeting of Russian military chiefs, Putin said that he is planning to deploy the hypersonic Satan-2 nuclear missile within weeks.

The mass-destroying missile can travel at a speed of 16,000mph, meaning it could hit the UK from 1,600 miles away in just six minutes.

After its firs test in April, Putin said the nuclear missile could "break through any defences", urging leaders "who try to threaten Russia to think twice".

The threat comes as Zelensky told cheering US legislators during a defiant wartime visit to the nation's capital on Wednesday that against all odds his country still stands, thanking Americans for helping to fund the war effort with money that is "not charity," but an "investment" in global security and democracy.

The whirlwind stop in Washington - his first known trip outside his country since Russia invaded in February - was aimed at reinvigorating support for his country in the US and around the world at a time when there is concern that allies are growing weary of the costly war and its disruption to global food and energy supplies.

Zelensky called the tens of billions of dollars in US military and economic assistance provided over the past year vital to Ukraine's efforts to beat back Russia and appealed for even more in the future.

"Your money is not charity," he sought to reassure both those in the room and those watching at home. "It's an investment in the global security and democracy that we handle in the most responsible way."

Just before his arrival, the US announced a new $1.8 billion military aid package, including for the first time Patriot surface-to-air missiles. And Congress planned to vote this week on a fresh spending package that includes about $45 billion in additional emergency assistance to Ukraine.

The speech to Congress came after President Joe Biden hosted Zelensky in the Oval Office for strategy consultations, saying the US and Ukraine would maintain their "united defence" as Russia wages a "brutal assault on Ukraine's right to exist as a nation." Biden pledged to help bring about a "just peace."

Zelensky told Biden that he had wanted to visit sooner and his visit now demonstrates that the "situation is under control, because of your support."

The highly sensitive trip came after 10 months of a brutal war that has seen tens of thousands of casualties on both sides and devastation for Ukrainian civilians.

Zelensky travelled to Washington aboard a US Air Force jet. The visit had been long sought by both sides, but the right conditions only came together in the last 10 days, US officials said, after high-level discussions about the security both of Zelensky and of his people while he was outside of Ukraine. Zelensky spent less than 10 hours in Washington before beginning the journey back to Ukraine.

Declaring in his speech that Ukraine "will never surrender," Zelensky warned that the stakes of the conflict were greater than just the fate of his nation - that democracy worldwide is being tested.

"This battle cannot be ignored, hoping that the ocean or something else will provide protection," he said, speaking in English for what he had billed as a "speech to Americans."

Earlier, in a joint news conference with Biden, Zelensky was pressed on how Ukraine would try to bring an end to the conflict. He rejected Biden's framing of finding a "just peace," saying, "For me as a president, 'just peace' is no compromises." He said the war would end once Ukraine's sovereignty, freedom and territorial integrity were restored, and Russia had paid back Ukraine for all the damage inflicted by its forces.

"There can't be any 'just peace' in the war that was imposed on us," he added.

Biden, for his part, said Russia was "trying to use winter as a weapon, but Ukrainian people continue to inspire the world." During the news conference, he said Russian President Vladimir Putin had "no intention of stopping this cruel war."
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world...e6b0007eb91e9b

[Jimbuna]

[Jimbuna]

[Skybird]

FOCUS analyses:
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On question of peace Selenskyj has meaningful message to Putin

Volodymyr Selenskyj did not flee from the attacking Russians. Selenskyj gave his country the leader it needed to resist. Selenskyj convinced the U.S. to ensure Ukraine's survival. Selenskyj has convinced fearful Europeans to help him do so. And now Selenskyj has united a divided Congress behind him.

In short, from the point of view of Vladimir Putin, who was hoping for cheering Ukrainians when his troops arrived, Selenskyj is the worst thing that could have happened to the Russian leader. After 300 days of war, it is clear that Selenskyj is Putin's biggest nightmare.

Here are the main lessons from Selenskyj historic visit to Washington:

First, Selenskyj's appearance in Washington was historic because he managed to convince even the majority of Republicans [Skybird: many Republicans abstained from attending, however, and some remained seated while other Senators stood and applauded, report various media]. He managed to do so with two arguments. The fight against Putin is not a regional but a fundamental issue: a war between freedom and dictatorship. And, American aid is not a gift, but an investment - Ukraine is grateful to the U.S., but the U.S. can also be grateful to Ukraine. Both houses gave Selenskyj several standing applause - as they last did to British wartime Prime Minister Winston Churchill 81 years ago. CNN commentator Frida Ghitis then called Selenskyj's performance "a triumph."

Second, Selenskyj managed to rally the totally divided, and even more, ideologically hostile American parties behind him and his goal. Whether it was a one-time success or one that will last is, for Selenskyj, literally decisive for the war. As of Jan. 3, Republicans hold the majority in the House of Representatives. This is where the decision on Ukraine aid will be made; Biden can't decide that on his own. So in the new year we will see - but Selenskyj at least tried everything, more is not possible in any case. Time magazine made Selenskyj the "person of the year".

Memorable statements on peace

Third, it was also about peace - and peace negotiations. And for the first time it became clear that Selenskyj is not free in his decision if and when and about which peace will be negotiated. In the press conference with Joe Biden Selenskyj was asked about it. His answer is remarkable - he used it for a public reflection on a "just peace" - a great philosophical topic. He spoke about the dead, including about "feelings of revenge" of the surviving citizens in Ukraine, and then said this crucial sentence:

"How will you explain to people who have lost their partners or children what a just peace is?"

Selenskyj's message: simply because of the sacrifices Ukraine has made, this struggle must continue. If he wanted peace negotiations now, he would lose the support of his own people. That limits his room for maneuver. That is real news.

Fourth, Selenskyjs, by his own admission, has a peace plan. He has discussed it with Biden. The plan consists of ten points. What they are, one did not learn. But that Selenskyj has a ten-point plan for peace is new.

Fifth, the West is united, but it is at a low level. Europe is responsible for this, Germany in the lead. Because Germany is afraid of a nuclear war, of a Third World War, aid to Ukraine only goes as far as Olaf Scholz's formula: Russia must not win the war, Ukraine must not lose it. The Americans go much further, Joe Biden explained - and admitted that he had already said too much. What was this too much? [Skybird: Bubble-Olaf also wants to reestablish trade relations with Russia after the war, he told German industry leaders just days ago, he even signalled Putin that he offers him trade relations for peace].

Why did the Americans deliver weapons only piecemeal - and not all at once, a Ukrainian reporter asked Joe Biden. His answer:

"There would have been a danger that the European Union and NATO would have broken apart." Golly - and why? Biden continued:

Different goals of U.S. and Europeans

He had spent "hundreds of hours" with the leaders of the European states - "face to face." To convince them why it was in their own interests to support Ukraine. "They understood that." In other words, the Europeans had to be convinced of this first.

And further, according to Biden: They, the Europeans, did not want to slide into a war with Russia - into a Third World War. Then the sentence that marks the crucial difference between Joe Biden and Olaf Scholz: "I think that can be prevented - by making sure that Ukraine wins on the battlefield."

That is, Americans, like Scholz, don't just want Ukraine "not to lose." Biden wants Ukraine to "win." [Skybird: the Germans deliberately do not want Ukreiane to win triumphantly, because that would destroy their plan to "not further provoke" and put to shame Russia with whom they want to flal back to ealrier trade relatiosn again].
The Americans are not afraid, like Scholz, that arms deliveries could trigger a Third World War. They are afraid that NO arms deliveries could trigger a Third World War.

That explains Selenskyj's sentence, "We are not afraid. You don't need to be afraid either." In the eyes of Biden and Selenskyj, who repeatedly emphasized how united they are on everything, the Europeans, apparently including Scholz, are driven by fear in their hesitation, while they themselves consider the fear of Putin's "escalation dominance" to be a fire hazard.

Sixth : What is the point of American and European arms deliveries, apart from Ukraine holding its own (in Scholz's sense) or winning the war (in Biden's sense)?

"We both want peace." Says Biden, referring to Selenskyj and himself. Peace, he says, will come when Putin says "pull out." In other words, pull his troops out of Ukraine. "But that's not going to happen," Biden says. Ergo: The U.S. is counting on a long war. And now?

Making peace with more and more weapons

Biden: "Ukraine cannot win on the battlefield without our help and that of European allies." And what follows from that? Biden: "We are putting this president in a position to decide how he wants to end this war."

In other words, without more arms deliveries, Selenskyj cannot win the freedom to decide whether to make peace. So at the end of this one-time visit, which began on a Ukrainian train and was made possible by an American military plane taking off from Polish soil, there is a paradox that is very difficult for Germans to understand:

Making peace with more and more weapons.
-----------------------------------

Do not trust the germans, I say it one more time. The Germans cannot be trusted. They easily play this even more underhandedly than France(lie the Germans, France hails itself for its close ties to Russia and you must only check the amount of military aid they provide in comparison to others to see that their policy reflects that basically positive stand towards Russia). Moreover, a free and war-winning Ukraine would massively shift the political balance in Europe, in favor of Ukraine and Poland and the Baltic states, and to the detriment of Germany and France, and the rest of Western Europe: Ukraine would be the most belligerent country in Europe, the country with the largest surface area, one with a large population, and the largest reserves of raw materials and the largest agricultural sector in Europe.

[Jimbuna]

In two days, 5 ships with 221 thousand tons of agricultural products for Africa and Asia left ports of Odesa. PHOTOS

As part of the "Grain Initiative", 5 ships with 221,000 tons of agricultural products left the ports of Odesa for Africa and Asia.

This is reported by Censor.NET with reference to the Facebook page of the Ministry of Infrastructure of Ukraine.

"Among them is the SEA BRIDLE bulker with 25,000 tons of agricultural products for Libya. Since the start of the grain corridor, the ports have sent 12 vessels with 305,000 tons of Ukrainian grain to this African country. Currently, 29 ships are being processed in the ports of Odessa. More than 1 million tons of Ukrainian agricultural products are loaded on them," the message reads.

2 ships are moving along the "grain corridor" to load 89,000 tons of agricultural products.

In the Bosphorus, 92 vessels are waiting for their turn to be inspected by the JCC. Last day, 7 vessels received approval for further movement after inspection. The Ministry of Infrastructure noted that for uninterrupted movement along the grain corridor, a minimum of 12 inspections per day should take place.

Since August 1, 574 ships have left the ports of Odesa, which exported 14.6 million tons of Ukrainian food to the countries of Asia, Europe, and Africa. Source: https://censor.net/en/p3388549

Peskov on meeting between Biden and Zelensky: There were no real calls for peace


Putin’s spokesman Dmytro Peskov commented on the meeting between Presidents Zelensky and Biden.

This is reported by Censor.NET with reference to RIA Novosti.

"We note with regret that no words have been heard from Biden and Zelensky about a potential readiness to listen to Russia's concerns," said the press secretary of the Russian dictator.

Also, according to Peskov, there were no real calls for peace.

"There were no reservations about the barbaric shelling of residential buildings in Donbas," he added. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3388554

Ukraine-EU summit will be held on February 3 in Brussels

The next Ukraine-EU summit will be held on February 3 in Brussels, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has already received an invitation to the event.

The press secretary of the President of the European Council, Charles Michel Barend Leits, informed the Interfax-Ukraine agency about this on Thursday in Brussels, Censor.NET informs.

"I can confirm that the Ukraine-EU summit will take place on February 3, there is an open invitation to President Zelensky to visit Brussels," he said. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3388564

[Jimbuna]

US has three different models for ending war in Ukraine through negotiations, - WP

In the USA, they see three models of what could be the end of the war between the Russian Federation and Ukraine through negotiations.

As Censor.NET reports, The Washington Post writes about it.

"There are three different models of what a negotiated end to the war could be, each of which has supporters in the (Biden administration. - Ed.)," the publication notes.

According to WP, the first part of the plan, which Zelensky proposed last month, calls for Russia to withdraw from all the territory of Ukraine it currently occupies, including Crimea and Donbas.

The other foresees the withdrawal of the Russian occupying forces to the 2014 line.

The third is the withdrawal of Russian troops from Donbas, but not from Crimea.

"Zelensky made it clear that he would not support the last two options, noting that peace can only come when the Russian invaders retreat from all the occupied territories," the newspaper writes.

At the same time, according to WP, during the meeting, Biden wanted to hear from Zelensky "current thoughts on how it should be." The publication's source said that "at the moment this is something of an academic discussion", as there is no evidence that Russia is interested in the conversation. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3388565

Russian officials will continue to visit occupied territories, - Peskov

Russia will continue to send its officials to temporarily occupied Russian territories despite the risks to their lives.

This was stated by the press secretary of the President of the Russian Federation Dmytro Peskov, who was quoted by the Russian mass media, Censor.NET reports.

"Look, there is a delegation of officials.
And it is absolutely normal, for officials to visit Russian regions and will visit, especially those regions that need special attention now, in the transition period, during their integration, adaptation into the entire life space of our great country. And officials are obliged to go there in large numbers," he said.

Peskov admitted that staying in the occupied territories is dangerous and carries risks for life.

"But this does not mean that these conditions should prevent officials from performing their functions..." he added.

The day before, it became known that Rogozin and the "prime minister of the DPR" Vitaly Khotsenko were injured during an explosion in a restaurant in occupied Donetsk. They celebrated Rogozin's birthday there.

Ukrainian border guards knew exactly where the former head of Roscosmos, Dmytro Rogozin, was in the occupied territories and reported this information to "caring comrades". Source: https://censor.net/en/n3388576

Head of IAEA, Grossi, convinced Moscow to create security zone at ZNPP

The head of the IAEA, Raphael Grossi, met in Moscow with the general director of Rosatom, Oleksiy Likhachev. They discussed the creation of a "security zone" in Russian-occupied Energodar, which would include the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant.

Grossi announced this on Twitter, Censor.NET informs.

Grossi emphasized after the meeting with Likhachev that "the key point is the focus of the zone exclusively on preventing a nuclear accident."

The head of the IAEA assured that he will continue to make efforts to achieve this goal "with a sense of extreme urgency".

The details of the negotiations - what this zone should be, whether all the troops of the Russian Federation will withdraw from there, or only those with heavy weapons - and other details have not been disclosed. Source: https://censor.net/en/n3388593

[FUBAR295]

Putin's chilling threat of Satan-II nuclear missile attack after Zelensky's visit to US

BRING IT ON!

I am getting really tired of Poopin's threats and sabre rattling. I hope both he and I are a our respective ground zeros if it ever happens.

I lived through the cold war hiding under my school desk because of the Soviet Union. I do not scare easily any more.

Yeah, he can nuke London in less than six minutes, but he has only twenty minutes before there is no Russia left, just radioactive char.

[Commander Wallace]

^ It's absolutely incredible and defies all logic that Russia, China and North Korea don't understand that the United States has more than enough nuclear weapons to annihilate all of them with weapons left over.

If Putrid had any brains, he would look at not only what Western weapons have done to his forces in the Ukraine but also ponder what weapons the U.S has in it's inventory that they don't know anything about.

That goes for the other Communist Countries as well. And, since England and America share ideas and technology, I'm sure the U.K has more than a few surprises up it's sleeve as well.

[mapuc]

I'm 99.99 % Sure he wouldn't use nukes or other WMD even if he lose face in his defeat in Ukraine.

It's nothing but empty threat.

Markus

[mapuc]

"Wagner" PMC received a shipment of weapons from North Korea, – Reuters.
"We can confirm that North Korea has completed the initial supply of weapons to 'Wagner', which paid for the equipment.

https://twitter.com/Flash_news_ua/st...J_iNd5VIA&s=19

So now NK has entered the war indirectly on the Russian side.

Markus

[Dargo]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Russian forces have entered the city of Bachmut in eastern Ukraine, which has been contested for months, according to British assessments. "Russian infantry are now likely to have gained a foothold in the eastern industrial areas of the city and have at times penetrated into the residential areas of the city," the Ministry of Defense in London announced Wednesday, citing intelligence. "Street fighting continues." It said the Russian troops were regular military as well as mercenaries from the Wagner group.
Fighting has been going on around Bachmut in the Donetsk region since June. Until now, the front line ran east of the city. The Ukrainian President Volodymyr Selenskyj had surprisingly visited Bachmut on Tuesday and distributed medals and gifts among soldiers. (Der Tagesspiegel)


In-city-fighting requires special training and skill, something I would not take for granted in Wagnerians and unmotivated Russian army reservist infantry.I assume the Ukrainians let them bleed for every row of house the Russians advance along. Question is - to what degree make the Russians the Ukrianians bleed in return?

The front lines around Bakhmut change daily Russian forces have entered the city of Bakhmut already twice this week but did not hold it Bakhmut is also not that important, certainly if you have been at it for 9 months it is an ego thing of that Wagner owner he promised he will do it better than Putin boy was he wrong

[Skybird]

I said it before, maybe we get misled by our mediabaout Bachmut, they tell us its a Putinesque ego trip - or it is a way of Russia to grind Ukrainian meat, because the Ukrainians must suffer heavy casualties there, too - and in their case its some fo the best units they currently have that get chewed on. Russia looses just - sorry - "meat".

Its hard to say whats going on and why without onpwinbg the ukrainian losses for sure. Ukrainian numbers given on Russian losses so far seem to more or less stay withoin the envelope of what others expect, too, but they give almost no data on their own casualties.

Note that the assessment on Russia establishing a lasting foothold in Bachmut is not mine, but that of the British, who so far seem to be quite good informed. As I understand it, before it was like the Russian entering Bachmut, and leaving it, and entering, and leaving. Now it is like staying in the east, and advancing towards the centre, and getting pushed back and staying in the east, and then advancing against the centre again.

For Russia, the region is about Ukrainian artillery being in reach of their extremely thin north-to-south supply line east of the city. This is what gives the city more of tactical value than Western media usually say: they usally say Bachmut has no value at all, but I think that is only true on the strategic level. In itself it has none, yes, but if the ukraine can have artillery in that region, it is in range to shell that road so vital for Russia.


But for the most I think the Russian use Bachmut to grind Ukrainian meat from some of the Ukrainian best units. A loss ration of 1:2 against Russia maybe is a good deal for them - what do we know. Western media are part of the propaganda battle.

[Dargo]

Originally Posted by Skybird

I said it before, maybe we get misled by our mediabaout Bachmut, they tell us its a Putinesque ego trip - or it is a way of Russia to grind Ukrainian meat, because the Ukrainians must suffer heavy casualties there, too - and in their case its some fo the best units they currently have that get chewed on. Russia looses just - sorry - "meat".

Its hard to say whats going on and why without onpwinbg the ukrainian losses for sure. Ukrainian numbers given on Russian losses so far seem to more or less stay withoin the envelope of what others expect, too, but they give almost no data on their own casualties.

Note that the assessment on Russia establishing a lasting foothold in Bachmut is not mine, but that of the British, who so far seem to be quite good informed. As I understand it, before it was like the Russian entering Bachmut, and leaving it, and entering, and leaving. Now it is like staying in the east, and advancing towards the centre, and getting pushed back and staying in the east, and then advancing against the centre again.

For Russia, the region is about Ukrainian artillery being in reach of their extremely thin north-to-south supply line east of the city. This is what gives the city more of tactical value than Western media usually say: they usally say Bachmut has no value at all, but I think that is only true on the strategic level. In itself it has none, yes, but if the ukraine can have artillery in that region, it is in range to shell that road so vital for Russia.


But for the most I think the Russian use Bachmut to grind Ukrainian meat from some of the Ukrainian best units. A loss ration of 1:2 against Russia maybe is a good deal for them - what do we know. Western media are part of the propaganda battle.

Russians thought it would take 10 days to finish this operation, we have now entered month 10 Ukraine has got yesterday months to fight on Russia still have the problems not solved they can have a large stock so tell me why they have to buy ammo from other countries if they have that large stock. There are many factors that the Russians underestimate about Ukraine and the west they could not win in WW2 without the supply of the west now they think they can, it is not that they get help from any real world power North Korea or Iran (both are heavily sanctioned) can not meet the supply needed China only wants Russia to start talks to end this. Putin lacks the authority to turn his mafia system into a war economy, the criminals only care for themselves...

[Skybird]

^ Still, I cannot see them needing to leave Ukraine any time soon. Somehow, they hang on. And destroy more and more of Ukraine's essential economy, industry, and infrastructure. Day for day for day.

The Kremlin is talking up the situation. But, so do the Western media, and to Ukraine's and/or Western purposes. They are certainly more skillful and less clumsy, and all in all, the truth content of their statements is probably greater than that of the Kremlin'S wooden-hammer propaganda. But they certainly do not describe the full picture. And even if they wanted to, they still could not.

[Dargo]

Originally Posted by Skybird

^ Still, I cannot see them needing to leave Ukraine any time soon. Somehow, they hang on. And destroy more and more of Ukraine's essential economy, industry, and infrastructure. Day for day for day.

The Kremlin is talking up the situation. But, so do the Western media, and to Ukraine's and/or Western purposes. They are certainly more skillful and less clumsy, and all in all, the truth content of their statements is probably greater than that of the Kremlin'S wooden-hammer propaganda. But they certainly do not describe the full picture. And even if they wanted to, they still could not.

Ukraine’s battle against the Russian invasion is consuming ammunition at rates unseen since World War II. Kyiv’s forces have been firing around 6,000 artillery shells a day and are now running out of antiaircraft missiles amid a relentless aerial onslaught by Russia, according to experts and intelligence officials. At the height of the fighting in eastern Ukraine’s Donbas area, Russia was using more ammunition in two days than the entire stock of the British military, according to the Royal United Services Institute. Ukraine uses up to 40,000 artillery shells of the NATO caliber 155 mm each month, while the entire annual production of such projectiles in Europe is around 300,000. The best way we can support Ukraine is to increase production of artillery shells now, this will be the single biggest issue next year if we can pull this off.