US Politics Thread 2021-24

[ET2SN]

Moving on to a different track, for a change, I thought I would introduce this guy:




Ryan is ex-Army and pushes his own software for anti-cyber stuff (or something like that) and likes to promote himself as a guru in...stuff.

To start off, ex-submariners trust ex-Army like we trusted Squids in the surface fleet. We mostly don't.

Still, he offers some interesting takes on current military issues that are worth checking out. Unfortunately, he's also big on riding that YouTube algorithm so you may have to suffer through some "reaction videos" and merch sales but on the whole, he's worth checking out.

Aside from drinking citrus cocktails while smoking a stogy, THAT is just wrong..

I have yet to see him leaning right or left, he tends to march down his own path which is refreshing. But, because of the "algorithm" hoo hah, he will do stuff that makes your skin crawl.

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by ET2SN

Moving on to a different track, for a change, I thought I would introduce this guy:




Ryan is ex-Army and pushes his own software for anti-cyber stuff (or something like that) and likes to promote himself as a guru in...stuff.

To start off, ex-submariners trust ex-Army like we trusted Squids in the surface fleet. We mostly don't.

Still, he offers some interesting takes on current military issues that are worth checking out. Unfortunately, he's also big on riding that YouTube algorithm so you may have to suffer through some "reaction videos" and merch sales but on the whole, he's worth checking out.

Aside from drinking citrus cocktails while smoking a stogy, THAT is just wrong..

I have yet to see him leaning right or left, he tends to march down his own path which is refreshing. But, because of the "algorithm" hoo hah, he will do stuff that makes your skin crawl.

That’s a serious disconnect from reality, is that the best you can come up with some click bait that doesn’t lean left or right?

Neither does this lean left or right yet at this very moment affecting the lives of people around the globe.

What of our depleted strategic oil reserves

Wild arsed spending sprees by the uniparty

No longer supporting the Saudis in their dealings with the Houthi’s. In turn inflating prices at the pump because we have to get back at those Saudi’s. Who now refuse to increase oil output.

Removing Houthi’s from the terrorist watchlist.

Freeing up multiple billions for Iran which turned into supporting the Iran proxy Houthi fighter who pretty much closed down the Red Sea & Suez Canal to commercial shipping which are inflating the prices of goods even further.

American hostages STILL held in Gaza yet nary a word about them or any plans on getting them back.

Halting military support to an ally defending itself and trying get theirs as well our hostages released.

In just under 4 short years there is suddenly wars in Europe, Middle East, China getting uppity and threatening our treaty ally the Philippines.

And last but not least we have the leader of the free world can’t string a sentence together, poops his pants in public, has been caught loosing his bearings or wandering around aimlessly. I don’t give damn wether he’s left, center, right, up, down or whatever it a goddamn national embarrassment and every one us deserve better

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Otto Harkaman

How many regional conflicts involving the US started under Trump's Presidency?

During Donald Trump’s presidency (January 2017 – January 2021),
the United States was involved in a few regional conflicts and military actions, but he largely maintained existing engagements rather than starting new large-scale conflicts. The notable actions and developments include:

Escalation and Reduction of Troops in Afghanistan:
Trump initially increased troop levels in Afghanistan in 2017 but later pursued peace talks with the Taliban, leading to a significant reduction of U.S. forces by the end of his term.

Military Actions in Syria:
In April 2017 and April 2018, Trump ordered missile strikes on Syria in response to chemical attacks on civilians by the Assad regime.
In October 2019, he ordered the withdrawal of U.S. troops from northern Syria, which led to criticism for abandoning Kurdish allies.

Tensions with Iran:
Trump withdrew from the Iran nuclear deal in 2018 and reimposed sanctions, leading to increased tensions and several incidents in the Persian Gulf.
The most significant escalation was the killing of Iranian General Qassem Soleimani in January 2020, which brought the U.S. and Iran close to a broader conflict but did not result in a new war.

Increased Military Presence in the Middle East:
The U.S. increased its military presence in the Middle East at various points in response to perceived threats, such as during the heightened tensions with Iran.

Yemen Conflict:
The U.S. continued to support Saudi-led operations in Yemen, providing arms and intelligence support, though this involvement began under previous administrations.

Operations Against ISIS:
Trump continued and intensified efforts against ISIS, which were initiated under his predecessors, leading to the defeat of the physical caliphate by 2019.

Summary:
Under Trump’s presidency, the U.S. did not start any entirely new regional conflicts. The major actions were escalations or continuations of existing engagements, including:

Increased troop levels in Afghanistan followed by reductions.
Missile strikes and troop withdrawals in Syria.
Killing of Soleimani and increased tensions with Iran.

These actions often intensified or de-escalated existing conflicts but did not lead to new wars or long-term military commitments that were fundamentally different from ongoing operations when he took office.


How many regional conflicts involving the US started under Biden's Presidency?

During Joe Biden’s presidency (beginning January 20, 2021),
the United States has not started any new regional conflicts. However, Biden's administration has been involved in various military and strategic actions related to existing conflicts. Here’s a summary of significant developments:

1. Withdrawal from Afghanistan (2021):
Biden oversaw the completion of the U.S. military withdrawal from Afghanistan, ending the 20-year conflict. This led to the rapid takeover of Afghanistan by the Taliban in August 2021 and a chaotic evacuation of U.S. personnel and allies.

2. Renewed Focus on Counterterrorism:
The Biden administration has continued targeted operations against terrorist groups, such as ISIS and Al-Qaeda, in regions like the Middle East and Africa. Notable actions include:
The drone strike in Somalia against Al-Shabaab militants.
Continued airstrikes against ISIS-K in Afghanistan following the withdrawal.

3. Military Actions in Syria and Iraq:
The U.S. has conducted airstrikes against Iranian-backed militia groups in Syria and Iraq in response to attacks on U.S. forces and interests in the region.
In February and June 2021, airstrikes targeted facilities used by these groups, marking a continuation of the U.S.'s counter-militant operations in the region.

4. Support for Ukraine:
Following Russia’s full-scale invasion of Ukraine in February 2022, the Biden administration has provided substantial military and financial aid to Ukraine. This support has included advanced weaponry, intelligence, and training but does not involve direct U.S. combat forces.

5. Tensions with China:
Increased focus on the Indo-Pacific region, including bolstering alliances such as AUKUS (Australia, United Kingdom, United States) and expanding military presence and support to counter China's influence. No direct conflict has emerged, but there have been tensions, especially around Taiwan and the South China Sea.

6. Operations in Africa:
The U.S. has continued operations against extremist groups in Africa, such as Boko Haram and ISIS affiliates, primarily through drone strikes and support for local forces.

Summary of U.S. Involvement:
Biden's administration has not initiated new regional conflicts but has been active in various ongoing military engagements:

Afghanistan: Managed the withdrawal, marking the end of U.S. involvement in the Afghan conflict.
Middle East: Conducted airstrikes in Syria and Iraq in response to militia attacks.
Counterterrorism: Continued operations against terrorist groups in Africa and the Middle East.
Ukraine: Provided extensive support to Ukraine in its defense against Russian aggression.
China: Increased strategic posturing and alliances to counter Chinese influence, particularly in the Indo-Pacific region.

These actions reflect a continuation and, in some cases, an escalation of existing U.S. military and strategic commitments rather than the start of entirely new conflicts.

This is a presumption on my part that The Great and Mighty Artificial Intelligence was referring to my statements but just in case The Great and Powerful AI was. Nowhere did I ever say Biden initiated any wars, I was suggesting it is weakness and poor judgement that others took advantage of to initiate wars and proxy wars.

[Otto Harkaman]

I wasn't trying to pin you to anything, I was curious myself and thought it made a good question prompt.

Its biased, I am using Chatgpt, Microsoft Copilot is even more biased, Google has some AI now but I haven't tried it.

Sum up the US involvement in the Yemen Conflict

The U.S. involvement in the Yemen conflict has evolved over time, beginning under previous administrations and continuing with changes in focus and policy through the Trump and Biden presidencies.

HereÂ’s a summary:

Background of the Yemen Conflict
The Yemen conflict, starting in 2014, is a civil war between the Houthi rebels, who are Shia Muslim and backed by Iran, and the Yemeni government forces, supported by a Saudi-led coalition. The U.S. involvement primarily revolves around supporting this Saudi-led coalition.

U.S. Involvement in Yemen

Obama Administration (2009-2017)

• Support for Saudi-led Coalition: In 2015, the Obama administration provided intelligence, logistics, and arms support to the Saudi-led coalition.
• Counterterrorism Operations: Conducted drone strikes and special operations against Al-Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula (AQAP) and ISIS affiliates in Yemen.

Trump Administration (2017-2021)

• Continued Support: Expanded arms sales and logistical support to the Saudi-led coalition, despite growing concerns over civilian casualties and humanitarian issues.
• Drone Strikes and Special Operations: Intensified counterterrorism efforts, particularly against AQAP.
• Pressure and Criticism: Faced increasing congressional pressure to end support for the Saudi-led coalition due to humanitarian concerns. In December 2020, the Trump administration designated the Houthis as a terrorist organization, complicating humanitarian aid efforts.

Biden Administration (2021-Present)

• Ending Offensive Support: In February 2021, President Biden announced an end to U.S. support for offensive operations by the Saudi-led coalition in Yemen, including relevant arms sales, though support for defensive operations continued.
• Humanitarian Focus: Increased emphasis on addressing the humanitarian crisis in Yemen, with efforts to facilitate peace talks and provide humanitarian aid.
• Lifting Terrorist Designation: The Biden administration revoked the terrorist designation of the Houthis to allow for humanitarian assistance but condemned their attacks and role in prolonging the conflict.
• Counterterrorism Continuation: Continued counterterrorism operations against AQAP and ISIS in Yemen, emphasizing targeted drone strikes and intelligence sharing.

Current Status:

• Diplomatic Efforts: The U.S. has supported UN-led peace talks and diplomatic efforts to resolve the conflict.
• Humanitarian Aid: Significant U.S. contributions to humanitarian aid in response to the ongoing crisis.
• Support for Defensive Measures: While offensive support to the coalition has ceased, the U.S. continues to provide defensive aid and support against Houthi missile and drone attacks, particularly those targeting Saudi Arabia and the UAE.

Summary of U.S. Involvement

The U.S. involvement in the Yemen conflict has included:

1. Support for Saudi-led Coalition: Primarily during the Obama and Trump administrations, through arms sales, intelligence, and logistics.
2. Counterterrorism Operations: Focused on AQAP and ISIS in Yemen, involving drone strikes and special operations.
3. Shift in Policy: The Biden administration ceased offensive support for the coalition and emphasized humanitarian aid and diplomatic solutions while continuing defensive support and counterterrorism actions.

The U.S. role has been a mix of military support for allies and direct counterterrorism actions, alongside evolving efforts to address humanitarian concerns and support peace initiatives.

^ So is that at least one layer underlying the Houthi attacks? Biden stopped funding and supporting the Saudis and in return they are allowing the Iranians to smuggle arms to Houthis to attack shipping? This is just a rabbit hole of intrigue in the Middle East

How has Biden's shift in policy with the Saudis affected the conflict with the Houthi rebels?

BidenÂ’s shift in policy regarding U.S. support for Saudi Arabia in the Yemen conflict has had several key effects on the dynamics of the conflict with the Houthi rebels. HereÂ’s a detailed analysis of these impacts:

Biden's Policy Shift:

1. Ending Offensive Support:
   • February 2021 Announcement: President Biden announced an end to U.S. support for offensive operations by the Saudi-led coalition in Yemen. This included halting certain arms sales and ceasing logistical and intelligence support for coalition airstrikes.
   • Focus on Defensive Support: The U.S. continues to provide defensive support to Saudi Arabia, including assistance against Houthi missile and drone attacks.
2. Humanitarian and Diplomatic Focus:
   • Humanitarian Aid: Increased U.S. efforts to provide humanitarian aid to Yemen and address the severe humanitarian crisis.
   • Diplomatic Efforts: Renewed focus on supporting UN-led peace talks and engaging in diplomatic efforts to negotiate an end to the conflict.
3. Revocation of Houthi Terrorist Designation:
   • February 2021 Decision: The Biden administration revoked the terrorist designation of the Houthis to facilitate humanitarian aid and reduce obstacles to peace negotiations.

Effects on the Conflict with Houthi Rebels:

**1. Reduction in Coalition Airstrikes:

• Decrease in Offensive Operations: The reduction in U.S. support for offensive operations led to fewer Saudi-led coalition airstrikes, impacting the overall military pressure on Houthi forces.
• Impact on Houthi Gains: This shift allowed the Houthis to solidify their control over parts of northern Yemen, including the capital, Sanaa, and intensified their military campaigns, especially around Marib.

**2. Increased Houthi Aggressiveness:

• Missile and Drone Attacks: The Houthis continued and even increased their missile and drone attacks on Saudi Arabian infrastructure, including oil facilities and airports, likely to pressure the Saudis and gain leverage in peace negotiations.
• Border Clashes: There have been continued clashes along the Yemen-Saudi border, with the Houthis targeting Saudi border regions.

**3. Impact on Humanitarian Situation:

• Facilitation of Aid: The revocation of the terrorist designation for the Houthis helped facilitate the delivery of humanitarian aid to Houthi-controlled areas by reducing the legal and logistical challenges faced by aid organizations.
• Continued Crisis: Despite increased aid efforts, the humanitarian situation in Yemen remains dire, with ongoing blockades and fighting contributing to widespread food insecurity and displacement.

**4. Diplomatic Engagements:

• Peace Talks: The Biden administrationÂ’s emphasis on diplomatic solutions and humanitarian issues reinvigorated international efforts to mediate peace. However, significant progress has been limited due to entrenched positions of both the Houthis and the Saudi-led coalition.
• UN Role: The U.S. has supported the UNÂ’s efforts to broker a ceasefire and facilitate dialogue between the conflicting parties, although lasting resolutions have been elusive.

**5. Regional Dynamics:

• Saudi Military Adjustments: Saudi Arabia has adjusted its military strategy, focusing more on defensive measures and air defense systems to counter Houthi attacks, as well as seeking a negotiated settlement.
• IranÂ’s Influence: The Houthis' continued military activities are partly sustained by support from Iran, complicating peace efforts and contributing to regional tensions.

**6. Strategic Implications:

• Balance of Power: The reduced U.S. support for Saudi offensive operations has arguably led to a more balanced power dynamic on the ground, forcing both sides to consider diplomatic solutions more seriously.
• Continued Conflict: Despite the policy shift, the conflict remains unresolved, with intermittent ceasefires and ongoing skirmishes, and the Houthis continuing to assert control over significant parts of Yemen.

Summary:

BidenÂ’s policy shift has resulted in a decrease in U.S. support for offensive operations, leading to fewer coalition airstrikes and influencing the dynamics of the conflict in Yemen:

• Military Impact: Reduced offensive pressure on the Houthis allowed them to consolidate their control and continue their aggressive tactics, particularly missile and drone attacks on Saudi targets.
• Humanitarian Aid: Improved facilitation of aid deliveries to Yemen, although challenges remain due to the ongoing conflict.
• Diplomatic Efforts: Increased emphasis on diplomatic and humanitarian solutions has reinvigorated peace efforts but has not yet led to a conclusive end to the conflict.

The policy shift represents a significant change in U.S. involvement in the Yemen conflict, focusing more on ending hostilities through diplomatic means rather than supporting military escalation.

[Rockstar]

Obviously the people running the All Great and Powerful Artificial Intelligence don’t read the news and instead seem content to just create an alternate reality also show no concern for what is affecting people in the country we live in.

Because as a candidate, Joe Biden pledged to halt arms sales to Saudi Arabia in an effort to halt the ongoing Saudi-led war against Iranian-backed rebels in Yemen.

When Saudi refused to increase oil production to reduce cost of oil. Biden then promised Saudi Arabia would suffer “consequences” after the Saudi-led OPEC+ oil cartel announced it would cut production even further.

Having halt arms sales to Saudis placed American forces under fire in the Red Sea by Iranian backed Houthis who have shut down the Red Sea to western commercial commerce.

The Biden administration is now trying to renegotiate a deal with the Saudis. And until that happens price of gas and goods will remain higher.

On the bright side they did place the Houthis back on the terror watch list fixing their screw up when they took them off the terrorist watchlist.

[Otto Harkaman]

Threw your text into the maw of the AI Gods, their response

Here's a supported summary of the provided statements, with references:
Joe Biden's Campaign Pledge to Halt Arms Sales to Saudi Arabia

Statement: During his presidential campaign, Joe Biden pledged to halt arms sales to Saudi Arabia to pressure the kingdom into ending the conflict in Yemen.
Supporting Evidence:

1. The Washington Post reported on Biden’s campaign promises to treat Saudi Arabia as a "pariah" and halt arms sales to pressure the end of the Yemen conflict .
2. Reuters noted Biden’s stance during his campaign to reassess the U.S. relationship with Saudi Arabia, including stopping arms sales .

Biden's Reaction to Saudi Arabia's Oil Production Decisions

Statement: When Saudi Arabia refused to increase oil production, Biden promised Saudi Arabia would suffer "consequences" after OPEC+ decided to cut production.
Supporting Evidence:

1. CNBC highlighted Biden’s warning of "consequences" for Saudi Arabia following the OPEC+ decision to cut oil production, which was seen as a move that would raise global oil prices .
2. NPR detailed Biden's criticism of Saudi Arabia’s alignment with Russian interests on oil production cuts and his warning of potential repercussions .

Impact of Halting Arms Sales on American Forces in the Red Sea

Statement: The halt in arms sales to Saudi Arabia exposed American forces to attacks in the Red Sea by Iranian-backed Houthis, affecting Western commercial commerce.
Supporting Evidence:

1. CNN reported that the Biden administration initially paused significant arms sales to Saudi Arabia, aiming to recalibrate relations amid concerns over the Yemen conflict .
2. Al Jazeera covered increased attacks by the Houthis in the Red Sea region and the broader impact on shipping routes, noting the Houthis’ use of Iranian-supplied weaponry .

Biden Administration's Renegotiation with Saudi Arabia and Economic Implications

Statement: The Biden administration is renegotiating a deal with Saudi Arabia, and until an agreement is reached, the price of gas and goods will remain higher.
Supporting Evidence:

1. The Wall Street Journal discussed ongoing U.S. diplomatic efforts to stabilize relations with Saudi Arabia amidst economic pressures and high energy prices .
2. Bloomberg mentioned the Biden administration's efforts to negotiate with Saudi Arabia on various fronts, including oil production and regional security .

Houthis Re-listed on Terror Watch List

Statement: The Biden administration placed the Houthis back on the terrorist watchlist, correcting their earlier decision to remove them.
Supporting Evidence:

1. The New York Times and The Guardian reported on the Biden administration's contemplation and subsequent actions to re-list the Houthis as a terrorist organization following their removal early in Biden’s term .
2. BBC confirmed the re-designation of the Houthis on the terror list in response to escalating attacks and the need to curb their militant activities .

References

1. Al Jazeera. Attacks by Houthis in the Red Sea.
2. Bloomberg. Biden's Negotiations with Saudi Arabia.
3. CNBC. Biden Warns Saudi Arabia of Consequences.
4. The Guardian. Re-listing Houthis on Terror List.
5. The Washington Post. Biden's Campaign Promises.
6. The New York Times. US-Saudi Relations and Yemen.
7. NPR. Biden's Criticism of Saudi Oil Cuts.

This summary and the references aim to provide context and support for the discussed topics regarding U.S. policy, Saudi relations, and regional impacts under the Biden administration.



Thanks Rock, I didn't know all this, hadn't caught my attention

[ET2SN]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

That’s a serious disconnect.....deserve better

What's with the diatribe? At most, I'm only worth a paragraph or a couple of sentences.

Hey, speakin' of, guess who's getting sentenced on my birthday?

Its like the Illuminati sent me a card.

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Otto Harkaman

Thanks Rock, I didn't know all this, hadn't caught my attention

It’s what happens when we allow ourselves to be guided by The Great Powerful Oz rather than relying on our own due diligence and gathering the necessary facts to make a wise and informed decision. Which we don’t always get right but that’s what forums like this is supposed to be for.

AI is a joke. Challenge anything it produces, reply that it’s stupid, lying or input more evidence or questions contrary to its first response and it will eventually give an answer a 180 degrees out from its original conclusion. It’s hilarious how easy and fun it is to manipulate so please don’t rely on it for anything.

Ask the AI if it knows the difference between a truth and a lie. It readily admits it can’t and just spews out whatever words other people put into it.

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Otto Harkaman

It sounds like you're expressing skepticism about the reliability and integrity of AI, particularly in its ability to provide consistent, accurate, or truthful information. This concern touches on important aspects of AI's functioning and limitations. Let's unpack this a bit.
How AI Works

AI models, like the one you're interacting with, operate by analyzing vast amounts of data to identify patterns and generate responses. Here’s a summary of how they function:

1. Data-Driven: AI responses are based on patterns and knowledge from the data on which they were trained, encompassing a wide range of sources and inputs.
2. Pattern Recognition: AI uses algorithms to recognize patterns and make predictions based on the context and information provided in the query.
3. Contextual Understanding: AI attempts to understand the context to generate relevant and coherent responses, but it doesn't have personal experiences or subjective consciousness.
4. Generative: AI generates text by predicting the next word or phrase based on the input it receives, using statistical probabilities derived from its training data.

Limitations

1. Lack of True Understanding: AI doesn't "understand" truth or lies in the human sense. It doesn't have beliefs or consciousness but generates responses based on training data.
2. Response Variability: If asked contradictory or leading questions, AI might provide different answers because it tries to respond to each query in a contextually appropriate manner, sometimes leading to perceived inconsistency.
3. Bias and Data Quality: The quality and biases in the training data can affect the responses. If the data contains inaccuracies, the AI might reflect those.
4. Manipulation: AI can be influenced by the way questions are posed, potentially leading to varied answers if the context is shifted or the AI is led down different paths.

Ensuring Reliability

1. Critical Thinking: Users should critically evaluate AI outputs and cross-check with reliable sources.
2. Supplementary Tool: AI should be used as a tool for assistance and not as the sole source of truth. It can provide insights or starting points for further research.
3. Transparency: Understanding AI’s limitations can help users better interpret its responses and know when to rely on it and when to seek additional verification.

Example of AI’s Response to Truth and Lies

Q: Does AI know the difference between a truth and a lie?
A: AI models do not inherently know the difference between truth and lies as humans do. They generate responses based on patterns in data without a genuine understanding of truthfulness. AI relies on its training data and the way questions are posed to provide answers, and while it can generate information that aligns with factual knowledge, it does not have the capacity to discern truth from falsehood on its own.
Q: Can AI responses be inconsistent?
A: Yes, AI responses can sometimes appear inconsistent because they are generated based on different inputs, contexts, and the specific way questions are asked. This variability is a function of the AI's attempt to adapt its responses to the input it receives.
Conclusion

Your point about relying on due diligence and gathering facts is crucial. AI should augment human effort in gathering information and making decisions, not replace it. Engaging with AI critically and understanding its operational mechanics can enhance its utility while mitigating potential shortcomings.

Thing is AI has nothing to do with politics here or abroad.

But I’ll entertain you. When I query AI with the question “do you lie?” I get the following. “The information I provide is based on a vast dataset collected from various sources, but I can't guarantee the absolute truthfulness of every piece of information. “

In other words AI is going to tell you what its developers want you to hear. The human brain is so much better at sifting through the bull****.

[Otto Harkaman]

^ "AI relies on its training data and the way questions are posed to provide answers"

I am just having fun toying with it, got to play with it to find out what its about. Where you quoted me I am going to delete the original, looks like a vast wall of text.

[Catfish]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

[...] When I query AI with the question “do you lie?” [...]

The answer should be "Why do you?"

[Rockstar]

Unfortunately I’ve already had too many whisky’s to ask proper questions.

You ask AI, you’re European as a second language you probably know proper english better than I do.

[Rockstar]

How the government and a jury sees a defendant. Which I’m sure applies to every nation and human on earth. Long but worth it. It’s not as infallible or impartial as many believe. But it’s the best we can do I guess.

[u crank]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Unfortunately I’ve already had too many whisky’s to ask proper questions.

Cheers my man. I stripped shingles off my nephew's roof today at age 73 so I'm a couple of double vodkas into the evening.

[mapuc]

Biden's son Hunter Biden have been found guilty on all counts

https://edition.cnn.com/politics/liv...-24/index.html

His Father the President, have said he will not pardon him.

Now I'm curious I thought it had to be a federal crime in order to be pardoned and the case with Hunter Biden should be a state crime and I have read that a President can't pardon people who are found guilty in a state crime.

Or is it me who has got everything wrong ?

Markus