The Way I See It - Page 4

Ducimus · 07-10-12, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by privateer

Corrected for posterity.

Oops. Yup, I stand corrected. As modding goes, I wouldn't touch SH5 with a cattleprod on the end of a 12 foot pole.

07-10-12, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducimus

Oops. Yup, I stand corrected. As modding goes, I wouldn't touch SH5 with a cattleprod on the end of a 12 foot pole.

I guess I have a 13 foot pole for now.

But I'm only helping figure out how to do model imports.
Not modding the Game actually.

Hinrich Schwab · 07-10-12, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red October1984

Where did you join the army? Which country do you live in? Just wondering, I have great respect for anyone who wears a uniform so their fellow citizens can sleep safely at night.

I am American.

I started my army days at Ft. Leonard Wood.

Quote:

Again, i have little to no programming experience. I dont see myself ever doing that. I see myself flying an A-10C over some battlefield in the near future, not programming the weapon systems.

The Warthog is absolutely golden when it comes to close air support. "Go Ugly" has a very special meaning.

Red October1984 · 07-10-12, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hinrich Schwab

I am American.

I started my army days at Ft. Leonard Wood.

The Warthog is absolutely golden when it comes to close air support. "Go Ugly" has a very special meaning.

DUDE!! Awesome!! I live within 100 (Im pretty sure) miles of Ft. Leonard Wood out near Cape Girardeau!! Had a friend go out there!

The Warthog is my all-time favorite. I really hope i get a chance to fly "Ugly"

Most of my family is Army, but im going to break tradition and go USAF. Ive always dreamt of flying.

Julhelm · 07-11-12, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JU_88

Then theres the IOS racer i worked on for over a year, do I even play that? No! it just brings back too many agonizing memories!

Which IOS game was that?

I worked on Golf Battle 3D and Turbo Grannies. Both done in about 8 months (actually 7 months for GB3D - we did TG in 5 weeks). I never want to crunch that hard again (actually I did when I joined EA DICE but at least there I got paid for doing so).

artao · 07-13-12, 07:36 AM

LOLOLOMAO

I'm not even gonna TRY to read this whole thread, but I can't resist commenting on the OP.

If everything was "over" or "dead" that people have declared "over" or "dead" over the years, there wouldn't be much left in the world.
... books are "over", desktops are "over, vhs tapes are "over, NTSC TV is "over" ... I guess I myself then am "over"

thebeasle · 07-14-12, 02:55 AM

Okay I guess everybody's heard about kickstarter.com by now.

I would love to see someone make a X-Plane type sim for subs. However, I'm not a programmer and at my age and occupation, I don't intend to learn how to program. So I can't / won't do it and can't really complain about other who can't / won't do it.

However, I'd like to see a group of programmers do it. I think there's a commercial market for it if it's good. I paid $80 for X-Plane 10. Millions of other people did too. And I thoroughly enjoy that sim.

So for now, I will just be grateful for the modders who took SH5 from a broken game to the best in series IMHO. I would also encourage programmers to take a commercial risk, design a hardcore subsim from scratch, and reap the financial rewards if the game succeeds. I think there's a large commercial market for a high quality hardcore sub sim.

07-15-12, 05:45 PM

Julhelm,
What you and many don't know?
There was a 'sort of' attempt to include some Modders on the SH5 project.
Had the details been worked out to those Modders satisfaction?
(NO! It did not concern money!)
I'm sure it would have been a different Game from what was released.

This is all second (maybe 3rd or 4th) hand knowledge mind you.

Is far as I know? An offer was made.
It was turned down.

So Modders will work with Devs and even do it for free IF it's a fair deal.
It don't need money being exchanged.
It demands trust!
Trust, or the lack of it, destroyed what SH5 could have been.

I see the On-Line version very open to the same problem.
They will not trust or contact the Modders.
So they will fail in the same way.

Julhelm · 07-16-12, 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by privateer

Is far as I know? An offer was made.
It was turned down.

So Modders will work with Devs and even do it for free IF it's a fair deal.
It don't need money being exchanged.
It demands trust!
Trust, or the lack of it, destroyed what SH5 could have been.

I see the On-Line version very open to the same problem.
They will not trust or contact the Modders.
So they will fail in the same way.

It got turned down, and always will. Even a one-man indie dev like Third Wire turns this down everytime it is suggested, and for good reason. The people who post on forums and who mod their games are in the minority. The big majority (maybe as much as 80-90%) of paying customers never go online to post on forums. So from a business perspective it would be crazy to cater exclusively to such a small niche within a niche.

As for SH5, had it had another 6 months dev time to finish features and no UBI DRM on launch it would probably have been an outstanding game. Since the online game by definition will continue to be developed over its lifetime I don't really see how it'll die like SH5.

Finally I would like to point out to you that the most commercially successful online games of the last 5 years have all been absolutely closed to modders.

RC0007 · 07-16-12, 08:15 PM

If only I was as good as the guy in the launch trailer...........

TorpX · 07-16-12, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julhelm

It got turned down, and always will. Even a one-man indie dev like Third Wire turns this down everytime it is suggested, and for good reason. The people who post on forums and who mod their games are in the minority. The big majority (maybe as much as 80-90%) of paying customers never go online to post on forums. So from a business perspective it would be crazy to cater exclusively to such a small niche within a niche.

It isn't a question of catering to a small niche, it is a matter of listening to the most dedicated and knowlagable players. You presume that the customer base is devided into a small group of forum posting users who want one thing, and a much larger group of casual players who want something entirely different. I think input from this forum would result in a better game for everyone, if only Ubi would listen.

Quote:

As for SH5, had it had another 6 months dev time to finish features and no UBI DRM on launch it would probably have been an outstanding game. Since the online game by definition will continue to be developed over its lifetime I don't really see how it'll die like SH5.

But it never got that 6 months dev time or much else really. Ubi may say SHO will be developed over it's "lifetime", but how long will that be? Most likely, Ubi will pull the plug as soon as they see it doesn't fit in with their 'get rich quick' business model.

PL_Andrev · 07-17-12, 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TorpX

it is a matter of listening to the most dedicated and knowlagable players.

Meeh! Wrong answer!
The "most dedicated and knowlagable" players are not important gruop with current business model - because it is a small group of players.
It means:
Release product as cheap as possible,
Show as advanced as possible,
Sell as much as possible (trailers, trade marks).

Do you see the place for modders? I'm not.

But it is not so bad how it looks. We still have independent, small developers from 'third world' f.e. Eastern Europe, Russia, India or China.
Hope that success of "World of Tanks" shows the new & correct way to new online sims (and sub / navy sims) in future.

Herr-Berbunch · 07-17-12, 02:58 AM

The best case I expect - people new to subsims to Google it and stumble upon Subsim.com, and then find SH3/4/5 and mods.

Hinrich Schwab · 07-17-12, 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TorpX

Most likely, Ubi will pull the plug as soon as they see it doesn't fit in with their 'get rich quick' business model.

SH5 is a precedent of this mentality being a reality. It is not an "if" it will happen, it is a "when".
There have also been times where I have wondered if an ancillary reason for making SHO was to intentionally shut out the modders because, to be honest, the modders keep showing up Ubisoft by fixing bugs the execs refused to allow its now former dev team to repair.

Julhelm · 07-17-12, 04:49 PM

It's a completely different business model, though. With a free-to-play game you cannot simply shut down development unless you want the game to die. UBI aren't stupid. You don't become one of the big 4 mega-publishers by being retarded. They have a franchise and they want to keep it a viable means of making a profit.

07-13-12, 07:36 AM	#51
artao Officer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 238 Downloads: 144 Uploads: 0	LOLOLOMAO I'm not even gonna TRY to read this whole thread, but I can't resist commenting on the OP. If everything was "over" or "dead" that people have declared "over" or "dead" over the years, there wouldn't be much left in the world. ... books are "over", desktops are "over, vhs tapes are "over, NTSC TV is "over" ... I guess I myself then am "over" __________________ l8r, artao

07-14-12, 02:55 AM	#52
thebeasle Watch Join Date: May 2011 Location: USA Posts: 26 Downloads: 73 Uploads: 1	Okay I guess everybody's heard about kickstarter.com by now. I would love to see someone make a X-Plane type sim for subs. However, I'm not a programmer and at my age and occupation, I don't intend to learn how to program. So I can't / won't do it and can't really complain about other who can't / won't do it. However, I'd like to see a group of programmers do it. I think there's a commercial market for it if it's good. I paid $80 for X-Plane 10. Millions of other people did too. And I thoroughly enjoy that sim. So for now, I will just be grateful for the modders who took SH5 from a broken game to the best in series IMHO. I would also encourage programmers to take a commercial risk, design a hardcore subsim from scratch, and reap the financial rewards if the game succeeds. I think there's a large commercial market for a high quality hardcore sub sim. __________________ -

07-17-12, 02:58 AM	#58
Herr-Berbunch Kaiser Bill's batman Join Date: May 2010 Location: AN72 Posts: 13,203 Downloads: 76 Uploads: 0	The best case I expect - people new to subsims to Google it and stumble upon Subsim.com, and then find SH3/4/5 and mods. __________________

07-15-12, 05:45 PM	#53
Madox58 Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Julhelm, What you and many don't know? There was a 'sort of' attempt to include some Modders on the SH5 project. Had the details been worked out to those Modders satisfaction? (NO! It did not concern money!) I'm sure it would have been a different Game from what was released. This is all second (maybe 3rd or 4th) hand knowledge mind you. Is far as I know? An offer was made. It was turned down. So Modders will work with Devs and even do it for free IF it's a fair deal. It don't need money being exchanged. It demands trust! Trust, or the lack of it, destroyed what SH5 could have been. I see the On-Line version very open to the same problem. They will not trust or contact the Modders. So they will fail in the same way.

07-16-12, 08:15 PM	#55
RC0007 Nub Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 4 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	If only I was as good as the guy in the launch trailer...........

07-17-12, 04:49 PM	#60
Julhelm Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Icy North Posts: 692 Downloads: 189 Uploads: 0	It's a completely different business model, though. With a free-to-play game you cannot simply shut down development unless you want the game to die. UBI aren't stupid. You don't become one of the big 4 mega-publishers by being retarded. They have a franchise and they want to keep it a viable means of making a profit.