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vdr1981 12-13-19 01:22 PM

Sounds really interesting gap but please note that all visual bonuses which AI could achieve by droping flares (SS and red distress flares) are removed from the game due to enormous lag and CTD problems...In other words, The flares are still there but they have no effect on AI visual sensors...:yep:

Tonci87 12-13-19 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2640182)
Thank you mate, I am glad you like my work :salute:



Sure! The file you want to edit is called torpedoes_g7a-e.sim (path: data\Library). This file contains controllers for all the torpedoes that can be used by the player; the ones you need to edit are named amun_*Torpedo (there are 10 of them). If you open any of them you will see that under the path amun_Torpedo\Pistols, there are several 'entries'. You should expand all of them, and if their 'magnetic' property is set to 'yes' you should adjust the corresponding 'mag_detonation_range' parameter to 4 meters, or any figure you think is more accurate.

When you have finished with all the pistol of one controller (1 controller = 1 torpedo with all the possible pistols), repeat the same steps with the next controller. Once finished with all the controllers don't forget to save your changes (right click on torpedoes_g7a-e.sim in the project tree and choose 'save').

That's it; probably easier done than said :03:


Should I use the Goblin editor to edit this file?
I tried, but I can not find the things you mention.

My issue with the magnetic detonators is that they do not seem to be sensitive enough. The torpedo needs to get extremely close to the targets hull before it detonates.

In real life the submarine crews actually did not have the luxury of having every single ship they encounter inside a Recognition book. So they did not have reliable draft information on their targets.

How did they do it? The torpedoes must have been more sensitive than they are in the game right now

gap 12-13-19 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fitzcarraldo (Post 2640259)
Great work Gap.. And yes, I would the dropping flares in TWoS! These little details make the game more immersive. Superbe job.

Many thanks and best regards.

Fitzcarraldo :salute:

Bringing this particular type of ordnance in SH is a bit tricky in many ways.
  • It was dropped like a bomb, but not necessarily on top of the enemy; on the contrary it could be used in the vicinity of the enemy to help locating it better.

  • On entering water, the ballistic portion of it should detach from the rest and disappear under the sea but, unlike regular bombs, the float portion should keep bobbing on the waves.

  • linked on top of this float and following it, should be a particle generator with a life of 5 minutes at full luminosity (plus 15 additional minutes during which the generator should gradually fade out), and the timer should start when the particle generator enters water for the first time.

Despite all these caveats, I am confident that with the appropriate controllers and some workarounds a flame float can be achieved in Silent Hunter games with a decent degree of realism. :yep:

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdr1981 (Post 2640267)
Sounds really interesting gap but please note that all visual bonuses which AI could achieve by droping flares (SS and red distress flares) are removed from the game due to enormous lag and CTD problems...In other words, The flares are still there but they have no effect on AI visual sensors...:yep:

Yes, I am aware of that. It is a pity that we can't have fully functional flares and they are only there for eye-candy. Do you have any idea on why the light node causes such a huge lag? Is that in vanilla game too? Have you checked if the problem might be caused by many flares being fired at the same time? :hmmm:

gap 12-13-19 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tonci87 (Post 2640270)
Should I use the Goblin editor to edit this file?
I tried, but I can not find the things you mention.

Yes, you need Goblin Editor for editing those parameters. if you are not familiar with it, you should first open torpedoes_g7a-e.GR2, and then merge in the project torpedoes_g7a-e.sim. Both the Open and Merge commands are found in the 'File' menu 'File' of Goblin Editor. After merging the sim file, the desired controllers will be found in the project tree (middle window in Goblin Editor), but you need to look for them as they are mixed together with many other controllers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tonci87 (Post 2640270)
My issue with the magnetic detonators is that they do not seem to be sensitive enough. The torpedo needs to get extremely close to the targets hull before it detonates.

In real life the submarine crews actually did not have the luxury of having every single ship they encounter inside a Recognition book. So they did not have reliable draft information on their targets.

How did they do it? The torpedoes must have been more sensitive than they are in the game right now

That's an hard-to-find piece of information. You might find an answer in the following document:

https://digitalcommons.georgiasouthe...99&context=etd

but be warned: besides historical plausibility, there are game play factors, (like the ones mentioned by Vecko in his reply to your query) that must be considered when adopting some settings rather than others :yep:

Tonci87 12-13-19 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2640288)
Yes, you need Goblin Editor for editing those parameters. if you are not familiar with it, you should first open torpedoes_g7a-e.GR2, and then merge in the project torpedoes_g7a-e.sim. Both the Open and Merge commands are found in the 'File' menu 'File' of Goblin Editor. After merging the sim file, the desired controllers will be found in the project tree (middle window in Goblin Editor), but you need to look for them as they are mixed together with many other controllers.



That's an hard-to-find piece of information. You might find an answer in the following document:

https://digitalcommons.georgiasouthe...99&context=etd

but be warned: besides historical plausibility, there are game play factors, (like the ones mentioned by Vecko in his reply to your query) that must be considered when adopting some settings rather than others :yep:




I have read that document, it is very interesting, but doesnŽt answer this question.

I have now changed the magnetic pistols to have a max detonation range of 4 meters and I have done some testing.

I think it is better now. The torps still have a high chance to pass underneath the target without exploding, and you still need to get pretty close to the keel if you want the torp to detonate under the target.

We must remember that SH5 surely measures the distance between torpedo and hull radially, that means from the center axis of the torpedo, not from its outer diameter.

I also tested with heavy seas (wind 15m/s) there is a chance that a magnetic pistol will detonate prematurely in these conditions, as there should be.

Also torpedoes seem to generally run about two meters deeper than set (at least in the test mission, or the ships keel is not as deep as advertised) :o


So all in all, 4 meters allows you to get a hit by estimating the targets draft, but still requires you to get pretty close. I would advise to incorporate that change into TWOS

@VDR, do you want the files?


P.S. If you look at the torpedoes in the editor, then you will notice that the G7es TX is the only torpedo that does not have a cavitation effect, apparently the entries for ParticleGenerator -> BitmapParticles are missing

Tonci87 12-13-19 06:27 PM

Another topic, the equipment fix mod needs a revision.

I became suspicious when I saw that I can purchase FAT Torpedoes in the middle of 1941 (they should become available late in 1742) I then had a closer look.

The TIII torpedo should not become available before 1942, however it is also available early in 1941.

The Conning Tower modification 2 should not become available before November 1942, in the game it is already available in early 1941.

See here for more information:
https://uboat.net/technical/flak.htm

I guess there will be more inaccuracies. Can somebody point me to the file with the start dates for the equipment?

Thank you.

gap 12-13-19 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tonci87 (Post 2640313)
I have read that document, it is very interesting, but doesnŽt answer this question.

Okay, I will let you know if I find something on this topic :up:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tonci87 (Post 2640313)
I have now changed the magnetic pistols to have a max detonation range of 4 meters and I have done some testing...

:up:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tonci87 (Post 2640313)
P.S. If you look at the torpedoes in the editor, then you will notice that the G7es TX is the only torpedo that does not have a cavitation effect, apparently the entries for ParticleGenerator -> BitmapParticles are missing

Cavitation effect or steam bubbles?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tonci87 (Post 2640324)
Another topic, the equipment fix mod needs a revision.

[...]

The TIII torpedo should not become available before 1942, however it is also available early in 1941.

When Equipment Upgrades Fix was first released it made all the upgrades available from the beginning, so to enable players to test all the upgrades and to report any problem wit them. If memory serves me well, the first attempt to restore historical availability dates was done by sober, but some equipment might still have wrong dates.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tonci87 (Post 2640324)
Can somebody point me to the file with the start dates for the equipment?

IIRC start/end dates and reward cost settings are found in data\UPCDataGE\UPCUnitsData\Ammunition.upc

the file can be edited with any text editor, and its settings are intuitive :salute:

fitzcarraldo 12-13-19 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdr1981 (Post 2640267)
Sounds really interesting gap but please note that all visual bonuses which AI could achieve by droping flares (SS and red distress flares) are removed from the game due to enormous lag and CTD problems...In other words, The flares are still there but they have no effect on AI visual sensors...:yep:

Though they can't work with AI sensors, could be a nice candy addition.

Best regards.

Fitzcarraldo :salute:

Muckenberg 12-14-19 04:53 AM

Hello sailors
I would like to thank you all for taking care of the SH5 and constantly improving it. Every small improvement will certainly show more in the game than we are able to estimate today.
Although I am not active on the forum so believe that I read everything that appears on the new thread.
You just do a very good job and I thank you again for it.

:Kaleun_Applaud::Kaleun_Applaud::Kaleun_Applaud:

vdr1981 12-14-19 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2640274)
Yes, I am aware of that. It is a pity that we can't have fully functional flares and they are only there for eye-candy. Do you have any idea on why the light node causes such a huge lag? Is that in vanilla game too? Have you checked if the problem might be caused by many flares being fired at the same time? :hmmm:

IIRC, the problem is not in the stock files because there aren't any light nodes in the flares at all. They have been added by TDW or some other modder I guess. I remember that first flare always caused the biggest game freeze which could last for several seconds...This would be especially annoying in airplane attack situations I assume. :hmm2:

vdr1981 12-14-19 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tonci87 (Post 2640313)


So all in all, 4 meters allows you to get a hit by estimating the targets draft, but still requires you to get pretty close. I would advise to incorporate that change into TWOS

@VDR, do you want the files?

Sure, you can upload the files :yep: but usually I don't implement these type of changes right away. Most of the time they require extensive testing since they can potentially bring several "hidden" problems along with the improvements...:yep: IIRC TDW's FX Update mod contains 3 optional mods for magnetic detonators. I took 2m option for TWoS since 1m (FXU default) just wasn't enough IMO. You can check out the mods in order to understand better what is going on...


Quote:

P.S. If you look at the torpedoes in the editor, then you will notice that the G7es TX is the only torpedo that does not have a cavitation effect, apparently the entries for ParticleGenerator -> BitmapParticles are missing
Could this be intentional? gap? :hmm2:

vdr1981 12-14-19 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tonci87 (Post 2640324)
Another topic, the equipment fix mod needs a revision.

I became suspicious when I saw that I can purchase FAT Torpedoes in the middle of 1941 (they should become available late in 1742) I then had a closer look.

The TIII torpedo should not become available before 1942, however it is also available early in 1941.

The Conning Tower modification 2 should not become available before November 1942, in the game it is already available in early 1941.

See here for more information:
https://uboat.net/technical/flak.htm

I guess there will be more inaccuracies. Can somebody point me to the file with the start dates for the equipment?

Thank you.

Earlier appearance of some weapons and equipment in the game is there to simulate new experimental and test ordnance and devices. I'm pretty much sure this was the case in KM as well and that certain captains would perform regularly "live action" testing of some new weapons and equipment long before their historical appearance date.

Despite all my efforts, I couldn't find the solution for conning towers. They have to bee offered always or not offered at all...

Tonci87 12-14-19 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2640331)

Cavitation effect or steam bubbles?

Cavitation effect

Tonci87 12-14-19 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdr1981 (Post 2640397)
Sure, you can upload the files :yep: but usually I don't implement these type of changes right away. Most of the time they require extensive testing since they can potentially bring several "hidden" problems along with the improvements...:yep: IIRC TDW's FX Update mod contains 3 optional mods for magnetic detonators. I took 2m option for TWoS since 1m (FXU default) just wasn't enough IMO. You can check out the mods in order to understand better what is going on...



Could this be intentional? gap? :hmm2:

IŽll do some more testing then :)

gap 12-14-19 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fitzcarraldo (Post 2640339)
Though they can't work with AI sensors, could be a nice candy addition.

I must admit that, when I come across some broken feature (all but uncommon event when talking about SH5 lol :D), there's always a little voice in my head telling me "there must be a workaround to this". Nonetheless I agree with you that, even though only cosmetic, those flares would be a nice addition that would possibly worsen the panic of a night attack by the air.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdr1981 (Post 2640395)
IIRC, the problem is not in the stock files because there aren't any light nodes in the flares at all. They have been added by TDW or some other modder I guess.

That's not entirely correct, there are light nodes in scene.dat, used for sun and ambient light, but I should probably reformulate my question: has anyone tested if in vanilla game with only FX-Updates added (that is the mod that added flares to the SH5 ships), star shells still cause that huge lag?

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdr1981 (Post 2640395)
I remember that first flare always caused the biggest game freeze which could last for several seconds...This would be especially annoying in airplane attack situations I assume. :hmm2:

Yes indeed, it would be very annoying to say the least :yep:

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdr1981 (Post 2640397)
Could this be intentional? gap? :hmm2:

I was wondering that too. Electric torpedoes should not have wakes, or at least they shouldn't have wakes as evident as steam torpedoes, but as the name says the wake of steam torpedoes was caused mainly by... steam bubbles. To the best fo my understanding cavitation should have affected electric torpedoes as well as steam ones (though, due to their slower speed, to a lesser extent), so if the empty field reported by Tonci is really about cavitation effect, it might be a simple overlook.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdr1981 (Post 2640399)
Earlier appearance of some weapons and equipment in the game is there to simulate new experimental and test ordnance and devices. I'm pretty much sure this was the case in KM as well and that certain captains would perform regularly "live action" testing of some new weapons and equipment long before their historical appearance date.

Yes, I agree, certain weapons and upgrades might have been available for testing before they were officially introduced in service, but for the sake of realism they should have a particularly high reward cost, and occasionally they should be affected by functional problems (that's easy to simulate with torpedoes).
On the contrary, updates that at a certain point were considered 'standard', should be completely free: an U-boat captain who was not enough charismatic or... aggressive as per B.d.U. desires would have been given a lesser important command, not sent to the Atlantic on an U-boat without torpedoes lol :O:

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdr1981 (Post 2640399)
Despite all my efforts, I couldn't find the solution for conning towers. They have to bee offered always or not offered at all...

To be honest I never found conning tower settings in UPCData settings :doh:


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