SUBSIM Radio Room Forums - Escorts in Wolves of Steel

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Escorts in Wolves of Steel

Still loving this game, getting good enough with the torpedoes that I may go with 100% realism next campaign. One question about escorts tho, did they really just go in a straight line slow with the merchants? They seem pretty easy to sink if so. I'm on med diff with all realism settings except no map updates.

tried googling this but only found strategic info, not how the individual escorts actually behaved.

they would go back and forth thing about targeting escorts is shallow dept and not worth the eel

Is there something like the uboats captain handbook that talks about their tactics?

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheNolan (Post 2783762)

Is there something like the uboats captain handbook that talks about their tactics?

There are various books written by various escort commanders, etc. "U-Boat Killer" is a good one. Various books about the escort carriers/groups have some info. too.

But no, they didn't just travel in a straight line.

Thank you for the suggestions. I also found https://maritime.org/doc/ which looks to have some promising articles.

I think the escorts in TWoS do rotate positions in larger convoys occasionally, and on all convoys they will randomly run search patterns. Still I find most of the time I can plot an ambush about 15 to 20 km in front of them and they will sail into it.

Kaleünacy 101 & a nod 2 Silent Otto!

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheNolan (Post 2783762)

Is there something like the uboats captain handbook that talks about their tactics?

JEEZE! Now that I've just been nominated for Most Helpful :o by Fitzcarraldo, I'd better live up 2 billing:k_confused: https://maritime.org/doc/uboat/index.htm
...actually posted recently by Silent Otto:salute: Required meticulous :subsim: reading from a 'primary source' ...no IMHO 'bout it! ENJOI!! :Kaleun_Salute:

Thank you for responding Aktungbby! Sorry for the poor wording on my part but I was actually wondering if there is a destroyer/escort captain's handbook, similar to the handbook for uboat captain's.

Edit: I had read the uboat handbook before but I totally missed it came from the maritime.org site lol

A "razz "of Contempt aimed at Hitler by Ms Laidlaw

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheNolan (Post 2783870)

Thank you for responding Aktungbby! Sorry for the poor wording on my part but I was actually wondering if there is a destroyer/escort captain's handbook, similar to the handbook for uboat captain's

Never apologise for poor wording in :subsim: Truthfully, the captured U-boat commander handbook allows a destroyer skipper to counter some poor 20-something expendible kaleün just out of training inept by-the-book rôte tactics in a limited submersible torpedo boat. Said kaleün's only alternative would be the Eastern front and inevitable slow demise by Cold, Starvtion, or overdose of Pervitin!!!https://cdn.theatlantic.com/media/mt...392-123230.jpg Plus once a group of ladies and an experienced Brit game designer laid out the convoy game on the floor; and came up with the raspberry tactic the jig was inevitably up!:know: https://time.com/5772665/uboat-wargames/

Quote:

As he watched Noble saw, for the first time, the cardinal errors that had been responsible for such tremendous loss of life at sea. When the demonstration was finished, the Admiral stood to his feet, congratulated Roberts and asked what the maneuver was to be called.
Laidlaw explained that she had christened it Raspberry.
It was, she said, a razz of contempt aimed at Hitler and his U-boat fleet.
The commander in chief then turned to one of his men and told him to take down a message to be sent to the Prime Minister. “The first investigations have shown a cardinal error in U-boat tactics,” he said. “A new, immediate and concerted counter-attack will be signaled to the fleet within 24 hours.”

But,again, in the interest of helpfulness: ENJOI!:salute:

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheNolan (Post 2783868)

Unfortunately, none of the escorts in the SH Atlantic settings (never tried the Pacific versions) behave as well as they should in regards to search patterns.

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Pancoast (Post 2783876)

Unfortunately, the escorts in the SH Atlantic settings (never tried the Pacific versions) behave as well as they should in regards to search patterns.

Pacific versions have more realistic AI tactics due to Japanese being worse at ASW than Allies, so poor AI is by definition more accurate :D

Quote:

Originally Posted by kapuhy (Post 2783950)

Pacific versions have more realistic AI tactics due to Japanese being worse at ASW than Allies, so poor AI is by definition more accurate :D

:haha::haha::up:

thing you got to think about tactics would change overtime depends on the year might be a outer ring exe some might be mowing the yard around the convoy

lol good call kapuhy.

Yes I'm still in 1940 so maybe tactics will evolve. Still a great game either way.

Merry Christmas everyone

Also, in terms of tactics used by the ai escorts in the Sh games set in the Atlantic, that silly move where the port/starboard escort peels off on a regular basis to go on a long extended sight seeing jaunt, thereby leaving said beam of the convoy completely unescorted and exposed, is completely ahistorical and unrealistic.
I suspect the developers put it in the game so players could do exactly what it allows; an easy way to attack the convoy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Pancoast (Post 2784758)

Do you by chance have links to some sources on how the escort behaviour should look in real convoy?

At the moment I'm busy with importing new ships, but SH5 AI is scriptable (TDW and vdr1981 already did a lot of improvement on it compared to vanilla game) and more realistic behaviour might be something to work on for the future, either for me or the other modders.