What next after "Iron coffins" And what was false about it??
I have about 30 pages to finish, but I searched on here and couldn't decide which thread to jump back up, so I started my own.
First.. I would like to know why and how this book was debunked.. What was false about his story? His girlfriends stories? His few battle stories (a couple pages for each) Is Werner still alive? I searched online and found a 90 year old guy named Herbert A. Werner that lives in Florida.. I feel like calling the published number and talk to him (if its still him) Finally.. I just read my first U-boat book AND LOVED IT!, thank you guys for recommending it to me.. But I feel I just read the "Saving Private Ryan" of books and nothing else will compare or give me the feeling of being there.. What would be a good choice after this book? something to follow a personal experience..., Again. THANKS EVERYONE! |
From Michael Hadley's Count Not The Dead:
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Das Boot stirred up a lot of controversy when it was published as well, but of course it was marketed and sold as a novel based on an assortment of real events, not a non-fiction retelling of them. It's also a great read and the paperback version is readily available from Amazon. Also good are Peter Cremer's memoir - in the English version I have, I think the title is U-333 - and Jordan Vause's books Wolf and the one about Wolfgang Luth, the title of which I've forgotten. I found Michael Gannon's Operation Drumbeat to be another compelling read. |
Here's Subnuts post about the book: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...17&postcount=1
He's probably still alive and lives in the US. |
Just a throw away book, you read it once or twice then throw it out and buy a book that is factual and not rose tinted glasses. :O:
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Thanks! I just read through most of that.. I don't remember any homing torpedo that was dropped after him.. But I might of missed a page ? Also, I don't see how its impossible to shoot down a plane with a WW1 gun.. A lucky shot could of easily done it and with the amount of times he had many chances.. Either way, This guy lives not 2 hours or so from me.. I think I am going to call him and see what happens if I start talking.. :) |
I was looking around for people in my past, and thought of a guy my dad used to work for. Yes, his name was Herbert A. Werner. My old man left for New Jersey around 1985, and came back home in 1987. I just remember the guy with his Mercedes Benz and his over-use of cologne.
I am very surprised to see he is still alive. |
For your next read, try Edward Beach's Run Silent Run Deep.
I think people are being a bit hard on Iron Coffins. It is a great read and I am sure there are many of us for whom this was one of the first submarine books we read. The story that Werner tells is true even if some number of the facts are not. Life on a WWII submarine is mostly boring so Werner, in trying to "tell his story" had to speed things up, combine things, and even fill in literary holes. If one is looking for an encyclopedic read like Clair Blair, Werner's book is not for you. If, however, you are looking for a perspective into the human aspects of German WWII submarine life, Werner's book captures the humanity. I have read a few submarine books in my time and few have been able to describe the human side of the German navy like Werner's book. Why would anyone be surprised at an old navy guy telling war stories that are not 100% factual? :har::haha: Perhaps he should started the first chapter with "there I was, no <expletive>, staring death in the face.... :D |
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"Dust..." continues right where the first left off and "Cold..." takes place during the Cold War. All are excellent reads. :yeah: Also read his book "Submarine". True stories of US Fleet Boats during WWII interspaced with his own personal accounts of his experiences as well. :) |
Steel Boats, Iron Hearts is like Iron Coffins, but better. IMHO, of course.
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I know this is old, but I searched my name a week ago to see what I used to write :) that said, I took your advice and got Steel boats, Iron hearts.. I read it in less than a day.. WOW!! WHAT A BOOK!! I had tears in my eyes :( Then for some reason since it said it was published in 2008, I thought Hans Gobeler, might still be alive :( he died in the late 90's totally better than Iron Coffins. I wonder if there are any more books that have this emotional effect? |
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I had wondered about this as well. I bought the book and enjoyed it a while ago. Had I known this, I would not have touched it. To me, him selling a fabricated story, as fact, is like someone claiming to have won a Silver Star when they did not. It is very disgusting. :down: |
According to an obituary for Herbert A. Werner he died on 4 April 2013 at Vero Beach, Florida, USA. This must be the same man, date of birth, name and location match perfectly (Obitsforlife).
Taken from uboat.net Rest in peace. |
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Weird...
The only copies I've ever found on Amazon were the classic hardcover ones that are like 30$ I'll save this and put it in my next Amazon order. :salute: Thanks Steve. |
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I was pretty sad when I finished Threat Vector.... I had finished all of Tom Clancy's Books.... :wah:
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I'm actually waiting for Iron Coffins to come in at my library, had to request it, also requested Das Boot book an the blu ray special edition(for a 2nd time:D ). I have read some excerpts from Iron Coffin, what I wanted to mention was as far as some thinking he was straight up lying about what he did or didnt sink, it was common among many many commanders to think they hit a ship an in reality didnt. Most of the time they relied on sound they'd fire an dive or fire an lower the periscope since they knew the escorts would be coming for payback. I just finished the book Wolf Pack the story of the U-Boat in WW2 an it talked about the differences between the allied records an the German records. It listed a few reasons why a Kaleun or the watch crew may of mistaken the amount of ships hit an sunk, such as pre-mature detonations, inexperienced crewman, ships actually being struck by the eel's but not sinking etc. I think the Allies, mainly Britain didn't always give out honest reports on sunken merchant ships, for two reasons, 1 being so they could continue to get more ships to become merchants for them. Like "Oh look the U-Boats are not as good as ppl make them out to be see?" cuz they had to recruit ships, an number two, propaganda to discourage the Germans an to cause confusion inside BDU. An for Werner saying he wasn't a Nazi I believe it Donitz went to pretty big lenghts to keep Nazis out of the U-Boats especially political officers, like the soviet commissars, I guess the German Navy had a history of trying to keep political types out, but from what I've read Donitz definitely didn't want them in his U-Boats.
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Just finished Steel Boat, Iron Hearts by Hans Goebeler who served on the U-505 which was captured 1n 1944 by the USS Guadalcanal. Hans later moved to the Chicago area to be close to the boat now on display at the museum of science and industry. He became a docent at the museum and often met with members of the capture team and members of his own crew. It is type IX and worth the visit. The book tops Iron Coffin as herr Goebeler was enlisted and has no axe to grind in his strait-forward recounting of his boat and crews' story. :arrgh!:
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