SUBSIM Radio Room Forums - Hamas launches war on Israel

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What's going down there in Gaza is terrible no doubt about it-However the information they get(UN, EU and other)is from Hamas. Which makes one wonder how reliable these information is.

Thousands of Palestinians have been killed or wounded-But not as many as Hamas claim.

Hamas started the war and now they and sadly the citizens in Gaza has to pay the price.

If the Hamas could fight the Israelis like real soldiers and not hiding behind the women or children

Markus

US government is turning zig-zagging into a new form of art. Is to be seen in its Ukraine policy as well.

Israeli ministers threaten to quit over ceasefire plan

Quote:

Two far-right Israeli ministers have threatened to quit and collapse the governing coalition if Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu agrees to a Gaza ceasefire proposal unveiled by US President Joe Biden on Friday.

Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich and National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir said they were opposed to striking any deal before Hamas was destroyed.

Opposition leader Yair Lapid has pledged to back the government if Mr Netanyahu supported the plan.

The prime minister himself insisted there would be no permanent truce until Hamas's military and governing capabilities were destroyed and all hostages released.

However, the White House said on Sunday it expected Israel would agree to the plan.

"This was an Israeli proposal. We have every expectation that if Hamas agrees to the proposal - as was transmitted to them, an Israeli proposal - then Israel would say yes," White House national security spokesperson John Kirby told ABC News.

Before the threats of resignation were issued, one of Mr Netanyahu's advisers told the Sunday Times that many of the plan's details needed to be worked out, and there would be no permanent ceasefire "until all our objectives are met".

But senior foreign policy adviser Ophir Falk also said Mr Biden's plan was a "deal we agreed to - it’s not a good deal, but we dearly want the hostages released, all of them".

The three-part proposal would begin with a six-week ceasefire in which the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) would withdraw from populated areas of Gaza. The deal would eventually lead to the release of all hostages, a permanent "cessation of hostilities" and a major reconstruction plan for Gaza.

But in a post on social media on Saturday, Mr Smotrich said he told Mr Netanyahu he would "not be part of a government that agrees to the proposed outline and ends the war without destroying Hamas and bringing back all the hostages".

Echoing his words, Mr Ben-Gvir said "the deal.. means the end of the war and the abandonment of the goal to destroy Hamas. This is a reckless deal, which constitutes a victory for terrorism and a security threat to the State of Israel".

He vowed to "dissolve the government" rather than agree to the proposal.

Mr Netanyahu's right-wing coalition holds a slim majority in parliament, relying on a host of factions, including Mr Ben-Gvir's Otzma Yehudit (Jewish Power) party - who hold six seats - and Mr Smotrich's Religious Zionism party - who hold seven seats - to maintain power.

But Yair Lapid, one of Israel's most influential opposition politicians, was quick to offer his backing to the embattled prime minister. His Yesh Atid (There is a future) party holds 24 seats.

He said the prime minister "has our safety net for a hostage deal if Ben-Gvir and Smotrich leave the government".

The row came as tens of thousands of people rallied in Tel Aviv, calling on the Israeli government to accept Mr Biden's proposed plan.

Many demonstrators also demanded Mr Netanyahu's resignation and some told reporters they feared the prime minister could torpedo the proposal.

A group campaigning to bring home Israeli hostages captured by Hamas has warned that such a move would endanger the lives of those held in Gaza.

Scuffles broke out between protesters and police, who used mounted officers and water cannon to disperse the crowds. Some demonstrators were reportedly detained.

Protests have become a fixture in Tel Aviv in recent months, as families of hostages and other anti-government campaigners have held rallies calling for a hostage deal - as well as for Mr Netanyahu to step down or call an election.

In a joint statement on Saturday, mediators from Egypt, Qatar and the US urged both Israel and Hamas to "finalise" Mr Biden's proposed deal.

Officials said that "as mediators in the ongoing discussions to secure a ceasefire in Gaza and the release of hostages and detainees", they "call on both Hamas and Israel to finalise the agreement embodying the principles outlined by President Joe Biden".

UK Prime Minister Rishi Sunak also offered his backing to the plan, telling reporters that his government could "flood Gaza with far more aid" if Hamas accepts the ceasefire plan.

Earlier, a senior Hamas politician told the BBC it "will go for this deal" if Israel does.

In a statement after Mr Biden unveiled the plan, Mr Netanyahu's office insisted Israel's "conditions for ending the war have not changed".

It listed these as "the destruction of Hamas military and governing capabilities, the freeing of all hostages and ensuring that Gaza no longer poses a threat to Israel".

The statement added Israel would "continue to insist these conditions are met" before agreeing to a permanent ceasefire.

However, the comments seemed to be vague enough for Mr Netanyahu to be able to claim that his objectives had been achieved.

Mr Netanyahu's office did not mention “total victory” - which he has repeatedly highlighted as a key aim for the war in Gaza.

This omission may allow the prime minister to reject criticism that the deal offers major concessions to Hamas.

On Sunday, Israeli President Isaac Herzog said on social media that he would give Mr Netanyahu's government his "full support for a deal which will see the release of the hostages".

"It is our inherent obligation to bring them home within the framework of a deal that preserves the security interests of the State of Israel," he said
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cz55y6k0p5go

US expects Israel will accept Gaza ceasefire plan if Hamas does

Quote:

The US government has "every expectation" that Israel will accept a ceasefire proposal that would begin with a six-week cessation of hostilities in Gaza if Hamas takes the deal, according to National Security Council spokesman John Kirby.

The three-part plan unveiled by President Joe Biden last week would also be a "surge" of humanitarian aid, as well as an exchange of some hostages for Palestinian prisoners before a permanent end to the war.

The proposal, however, has met with vocal opposition from some members of Israel's government.

The negotiations come as fighting continues in Rafah, which came under intense Israeli airstrikes over the weekend.

According to the UNRWA, the UN agency for Palestinian refugees, all 36 of its shelters in the Rafah area are empty after residents were forced to flee.

Another 1.7 million people are estimated to be displaced in Khan Younis and parts of central Gaza.

Speaking to ABC News on Sunday morning, Mr Kirby said that the US had "every expectation" that Israel would "say yes" to the proposed ceasefire deal if Hamas accepts.

"We're waiting for an official response from Hamas," he said, adding that the US hopes that both sides agree to start the first phase of the plan "as soon as possible".

During that initial six-week pause in the fighting, Mr Kirby said the "two sides would sit down and try to negotiate what phase two could look like, and when that could begin".

In a televised address last week, Mr Biden said that the second phase of the plan would see all remaining living hostages returned, including male soldiers. The ceasefire would then become "the cessation of hostilities, permanently".

On Saturday, however, two far-right Israeli ministers threatened to quit and collapse the country's governing coalition if Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu agreed to the deal.

Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich and National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir said they were opposed to striking any deal before Hamas was destroyed.

Similarly, Mr Netanyahu has insisted that there will be no ceasefire until Hamas’s military and governing capabilities are destroyed and all hostages are released.

Mr Kirby, for his part, said that US intelligence now believes that Hamas has been militarily degraded to the extent that it can no longer repeat an attack such as that which its fighters conducted on 7 October.

"We've not said that they don't still represent a viable threat to the Israeli people. Of course they do," he said. "But they don't have the military capabilities to do what they did."

In another development on Sunday, the government of the Maldives announced it would ban Israeli citizens from the Indian Ocean island archipelago, in turn prompting a warning from Israel's foreign ministry that its citizens should avoid the country.

About 11,000 Israelis visited the Maldives last year - less than 1% of all tourist arrivals.

More than 36,000 people have been killed across Gaza since the start of the conflict, according to the Hamas-run health ministry.

The war began in October when Hamas gunmen launched an unprecedented attack on Israel, killing about 1,200 people and taking 252 back to Gaza as hostages.

In the US, President Biden has faced growing domestic criticism over the level of US support for Israel, as well as calls to do more to encourage the warring sides to negotiate.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cd11l590qqwo