SUBSIM Radio Room Forums - [WIP] Japanese Campaign

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- - [WIP] Japanese Campaign (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=141869)

Quote:

Originally Posted by tater (Post 1475112)

The 2d image is Hiryu.

What I need is a functional ASW mortar...

IJN antisub mortar ?

It was installed on many small escorts, and many merchant ships. Often times it was an Army 81mm mortar. There was 15cm design as well that was specifically an ASW mortar. It fired a ~60lb (27 kg) projectile ~4,500 yards.

Such a weapon would need to be grossly inaccurate, however.

ASW Mortars

Quote:

A 15 cm (5.9") ASW mortar was developed for transports and merchant ships. This was in a cradle mounting allowing 360 degree traverse and had recoil and runout cylinders. The projectile weighed about 60 lbs. (27 kg) and could range out to a maximum of 4,500 yards (4,100 m).

The Navy 81 mm mortar was also carried by many escorts, firing standard projectiles.

Finally, a 15 cm (5.9") rocket propelled DC with a range of 3,280 yards (3,000 meters) was developed in April 1945 but this saw no active service.

http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WAMJAP_ASW.htm

you could do that by cloning an existing one etc... but since we are playing the other side... we don't have it unless there was a similar setup on US ships ?

keltos

It's a mortar, and as an AI weapon, it needn't be complicated. 15cm tube with a couple struts and a base plate :)

Heck, even I might be able to make one of those :)

Great work guys, IJN campaign is way more interesting then USA one. Any of u have game War in The Pacific Admiral's Edition? It might be some help for u about ships/planes/ports/garrisons and other stuff.

Keltos, I'm not all that interested in US stuff, frankly, I suppose once I start playing an IJN career, that might change a little. It's certainly possible to do at some point. I think it's because I don't think of US ships as "targets" that I'm disinterested :)

Within IJN doctrine, at least there is a good selection of US warships as targets for you, though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tater (Post 1475253)

We needn't worry about the lack of targets ;) but I guess the fight will be harder and harder as the war goes on...

keltos

Playing an IJN sub will be pretty scary I imagine. BY the time you see them, they've already seen you with radar. Then the FIDOs come, lol.

Reminds me of an old Matt Groening cartoon (life in hell). The caption is:
"Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra and then suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath. At night, the ice weasels come."

http://a.imageshack.us/img137/20/waspo.jpg

I was told to go to the Northern Cape and make them feel we were there !

http://a.imageshack.us/img299/9864/hurt.jpg

there were 2 wasp carriers... one was launching planes !!

http://a.imageshack.us/img822/7761/hurtw.jpg

that plane got off just in time !!! ;)

I then moved south to Freemantle, got me three DDs including one coming to the rescue of another using a Type 92 electric torpedo.. You gotta love the range on those things !

two away... we'll see..

two carriers down :) why don't those DDs come out for a fight ???

ok, firing stern tubes at a CA of some kind, those are electric torpedoes...

http://a.imageshack.us/img69/7253/87546095.jpg

two hits !!! who says it's not fair ???

http://a.imageshack.us/img413/74/damagej1m.jpg

slightly damaged coming out... gosh it it shallow here !

k

will be playable Ko Hyoteki included in this mod?

Quote:

Originally Posted by keltos01 (Post 1470253)

just the one :

USS Monaghan (DD-354) foundered during a typhoon in the Philippine Sea, 18 December 1944.

and :

USS Warrington (DD-383) foundered in a hurricane north of the Bahamas Islands,
13 September 1944.

http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq82-1.htm

but I don't know if that can be implemented ingame

keltos

Just one? How about USS Hull (DD-350), USS Spence (DD-512) and a group of other ships that were not DD by class? I also heard that a Typhoon sabotaged US Navy operations against some Japanese held island by damaging aircraft carriers. Only battleships in that task force were seaworthy enough to make it without even the smallest damage...and that same task force suffered the biggest weather related destroyer losses as far as I can remember. It is useless to talk about details otherwise but I just wish to point out that it would be a great thing if extremely adverse weather conditions could be implemented because they would not be only realistic but could make a BIG difference to many things and they could either hamper players efforts as well as sometimes could be used by the player to the point of saving his life, crew and sub. Horrible sea/weather conditions could for example make a hostile light cruiser give up a depth charge attack on the player because of getting bigger problems to worry about.

If these following features can be implemented, I would like to suggest them too:

1) It would be realistic if the player was also sometimes attacked by a hostile submarine. Sinking an enemy sub should bring some renown too. However if this cannot be implemented in a way that other players would consider a great thing rather than become annoyed by it (a terrible danger, little renown in prevailing, very hard to hit with torpedoes forcing you to waste many of them, difficult to find a submerged enemy sub even with a hydrophone), then forget it. If I was a sub skipper in real life, I would certainly not be happy to encounter an enemy sub either. Probably it could be made easy in the manner that the enemy sub made mistakes in these encounters often. The player could probably deceive it into surfacing if he was silent for a long time (lets assume the enemy skipper is a rookie but some enemy captains could be cunning and deadly too).

2) Another interesting feature could be if you could rescue hostiles from the sea in the same manner than pilots from your own side. Taking POWs should probably be scripted to give you less renown than rescuing friendlies though but still even enemy personnel would be worth something as your superiors could, for example, command them to build railroads and bridges to Burma (ever watch The Bridge on River Kwai? It does not tell the whole truth though). Hostile personnel in the sea should probably also be scripted to draw in enemy forces if they received his mayday but it should be safe to rescue the bailed out Dauntless pilot that just tried to bomb your sub a few seconds ago.

3) There should also be a feature for the player to commit atrocities but choosing to have any "fun" could result in the game telling the player he got in trouble with Allied war crimes trials at the end of campaign...though he could receive additional praise from some evil superiors during the campaign (being cruel to enemies was in Japanese religion & culture I think. Due to that, some American military personnel stopped having any sympathy on the Japanese).

4) At the end of campaign, the player could choose whether to surrender to Americans or refuse to accept the terrible disgrace of surrendering to enemies and rather sail to some faraway, neutral land (especially Argentina under Peron was symphatetic to some Axis personnel after WW2 and the player probably heard about this as a "well kept secret" told by some crew member of one of those monsoon uboats who happens to be a member of nazi party). Many of the Japanese Naval Infantry defending the islands, committed suicide rather than to surrender to the victorious boys of U.S. Marine Corps. Fleeing to another country could be an alternative especially to an atrocite committer.

5) The campaign could start from the Second Sino-Japanese War (to get pre-WW2 experience for you and your crew) but it would not include many patrols as I think it did not take long for IJN to completely eliminate Chinese fleet.

I still watched some of the earlier messages after replying to your long ago message.

You have done really good work Keltos and others! Diversity in choice of submarines and equipment is what I think everyone wants and what would be realistic. How about one of the missions for Junsen or other very long range sub would be to pay a visit to a German base in Europe and come back? That would give you some renown for bringing back some precious blueprints and models from German engineers and also give the player a realistic chance to refit his submarine with Kriegsmarine issue equipment.

Hmm...13.2 mm machine gun and 7.7 mm machine gun? Thank you for the realism but if that is all IJN has got, then I also have to thank you for not giving me that same deadly temptation to stay on the surface to fight it out with the Catalinas that I often have when playing SH3. They are a tough cookie even with two 20mm Flakzwilings and one 37mm. What comes to Liberators...they are a complete waste of ammunition even for a heavily flakked Uboat. In SH3 I have set many Liberators on fire but I never was able to bring even one down. When seeing them in SH4's Japanese Campaign, I will probably tell my 7.7mm gunner to just get inside and have a round of cards with off duty crewmen. Hopefully, there will be more powerful guns than 13.2 mm. They would be extremely welcome but forget it if it is not realistic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfamemnon (Post 1476136)

If these following features can be implemented, I would like to suggest them too:

1) It would be realistic if the player was also sometimes attacked by a hostile submarine.

It might be fun, but it would not be realistic. There will be enemy subs on the surface that will fire there deckguns at you, and submerged subs that you can "try" to sink but neither one shoots torpedoes.

2) Another interesting feature could be if you could rescue hostiles from the sea

I do not think that can be done in the game, and it would also not be realistic. The captain would not put his sub in danger from enemy attack to stay surfaced to rescue the enemy.

4) At the end of campaign, the player could choose whether to surrender to Americans or refuse to accept the terrible disgrace of surrendering to enemies and rather sail to some faraway, neutral land (especially Argentina under Peron was symphatetic to some Axis personnel after WW2 and the player probably heard about this as a "well kept secret" told by some crew member of one of those monsoon uboats who happens to be a member of nazi party). Many of the Japanese Naval Infantry defending the islands, committed suicide rather than to surrender to the victorious boys of U.S. Marine Corps. Fleeing to another country could be an alternative especially to an atrocite committer.

I do not know any way to change the ending to do what you suggest, the game just ends with a message. The message could be changed but I do not know if there is any way to MOD a choice for the ending.

5) The campaign could start from the Second Sino-Japanese War (to get pre-WW2 experience for you and your crew) but it would not include many patrols as I think it did not take long for IJN to completely eliminate Chinese fleet.

With the limited time I have to work on this Campaign, and having to learn as I go, I don't have time right now for this. Maybe in a later release if the Campaign works out ok.

Peabody

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfamemnon (Post 1476390)

I still watched some of the earlier messages after replying to your long ago message.

Hmm...13.2 mm machine gun and 7.7 mm machine gun? Thank you for the realism but if that is all IJN has got, then I also have to thank you for not giving me that same deadly temptation to stay on the surface to fight it out with the Catalinas that I often have when playing SH3. They are a tough cookie even with two 20mm Flakzwilings and one 37mm. What comes to Liberators...they are a complete waste of ammunition even for a heavily flakked Uboat. In SH3 I have set many Liberators on fire but I never was able to bring even one down. When seeing them in SH4's Japanese Campaign, I will probably tell my 7.7mm gunner to just get inside and have a round of cards with off duty crewmen. Hopefully, there will be more powerful guns than 13.2 mm. They would be extremely welcome but forget it if it is not realistic.

The 7.7mm and the 13.2mm were recent additions to the game at the beginning. Most of the war the Japanese subs used 25mm. We have 25mm single barrel, double barrel, and triple barrel flak guns.
For the deckgun we start with the 105mm and go to a 5.5 inch single barrel and then a 5.5 inch double barrel as shown in some research we have done.

Peabody

peabody, are you using all random groups, or are you also messing with "scripted" mission files?

As lurker and I discovered doing our own campaign mods, the "scripted" groups (dragging a ship class to the map, instead of placing a random group with that ship class within it, 100%) have some serious "issues." As a result, it is always better to have groups be of the random variety. If precise timing is required, hand edit

DelayMin=
DelayMinInterv=

to both equal 1, and things will spawn on time.

One issue is the airgroup bug, for example. If you had a "scripted" US CV, the point of waypoint 0 will have an airgroup on it, even if the CV has not yet spawned. There are other issues as well. Avoid those.